Critics of Indiana’s Religious Freedom Law Are Trying To Have Their Cake and Eat it, Too

Wedding_cake_with_pillar_supports,_2009Below is my Sunday column in the Washington Post on Indiana’s Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA).

The column below raises the question of line drawing and states that I would prefer an absolute rule requiring all services. However, I could not support such a rule if we are going to strip protection from “wrong” views while allowing others to refuse on the ground that other symbols or language are clearly offensive. One variation on the “No Cake For You” approach below was suggested by a colleague who said that we could allow bakers and others to refuse any offensive language — religious or non-religious — unless the government could show that the baker would have sold the cake but for the status of the prospective buyer (e.g., gay or straight, Jewish or not, etc.). Thus, as long as the basis of the refusal was the actual language or symbols, it would be protected as an expressive act.

As I say in the column, I continue to struggle with drawing this line. None of the options are particularly satisfying. However, I do think that we have to have a real dialogue on this issue free of low-grade efforts to those on the other side as bigoted for wanting to discuss the range of free speech conflicts. The point is that, when dealing with the question of the right to refuse to create offensive symbols or language, one must address the fact that there are a wide array of such conflicts that can arise among different religious, cultural, or political groups. One does not have to agree with their speech to raise the question of their right to engage in such speech. Indeed, the first amendment is designed to protect unpopular speech. We do not need it to protect popular speech. Some may ultimately decided that no business can refuse any message under the “Let Them Eat Cake” approach despite rulings like Hobby Lobby and Citizens United. However, the first step is to have the debate, preferably free of personal attacks or attempts to silence those who would raise the speech of other unpopular or offensive groups.

Here is the column:

Within minutes of the signing of Indiana’s Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA), a chorus of condemnation arose across the country that threw Indiana Governor Mike Pence and his colleagues back on their heels. The response was understandable, though somewhat belated. After all, both Presidents Bill Clinton and Barack Obama supported similar language that is found not only in federal law but the laws of 19 other states. While broader than most of these laws, the premise of the Indiana law was the same: citizens could raise religious beliefs as a defense to governmental obligations or prohibitions.

For those of us who have been warning for years about the collision of anti-discrimination laws and religious beliefs, the current controversy was a welcomed opportunity to have this long-avoided debate. Yet, we are still not having that debate. Instead, there is a collective agreement that discrimination is wrong without addressing the difficult questions of where to draw the line between the ban on discrimination and the right to free speech and free exercise. That includes the question of why only religious speech should be protected in such conflicts, as noted in the column. Yet, there is a reluctance of acknowledge good faith concerns among religious people in fear of being viewed as bigoted.

There has been a great deal of heated rhetoric in this discussion that avoids many of the more difficult questions. For example there is the common criticism that these bakers cannot assert their religious beliefs when it is really their business that is being required to take certain actions. However, last year, the Supreme Court in Burwell v. Hobby Lobby Stores, Inc. expressly found that such businesses do have religious rights (as they do speech rights, as recognized in Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission). In 2014, the Court ruled that “no conceivable definition of the term includes natural persons and nonprofit corporations, but not for-profit corporations.” Likewise, despite arguments that the federal RFRA is narrower because it references only conflicts with the government (and not other private parties in the Indiana law), some courts have ruled that it can be used in civil litigation.

As expected, the response of some commentators was to condemn even raising these question of free speech by saying that it saying that it equates gay couples to the KKK or Nazi sympathizers. Even when admitting that they do not have an answer for the free speech question, the attack is on the raising of such questions. There are legitimate concerns over allowing businesses to refuse to prepare products deemed offensive due to symbols or language, but we cannot really address these issues if people are denounced for just raising the conflicts and discussing conflicts. It results in a circular position that we can discuss the question of the protection of offensive speech but not if the question is offensive to discuss. This is an unfortunate trend where difficult questions are avoided by attacking those raising them as presumptive racists or homophobes etc for even raising different types of speech or views. It is a rather odd position to be placed in given my writings for decades supporting gay rights and same sex marriage. More importantly, when discussing the limits of free speech, one necessarily discusses the broad spectrum of free speech examples, including offensive speech. There is not an effort to equate gay marriage symbols or language with anti-Semitimic symbols or language. Obviously, as a supporter of same-sex marriage, I reject that notion. However, the point is that some people hold opposing views from my own. Some of those views I find deeply offensive. If we want to discuss the growing limitations on speech, we need to explore the spectrum of different forms of speech. That is what CNN did in the interview when raising the “KKK cake.” CNN was not saying that such a view is equally valid on the merits. It is ridiculous to say that, by discussing what different people consider offensive, we are saying that all of those views are valid or correct. It is not enough to say that such people are simply wrong or there is clearly a difference in the “real” offensiveness of the messages. Indeed, in some ways, such critics are answering the question by saying that some views are simply not viable because they are wrong. That is saying that society will draw the line on what speech can be the basis for refusing services and what cannot be such a basis.

After all the heated rhetoric over Indiana’s controversial religious freedom law, this rights debate could ultimately come down to a cake war. Just as diners were at the epicenter of the fight over racial desegregation, bakeries have become a flashpoint today.

Conservatives in Indiana and elsewhere have objected to bakers (and florists and photographers) being “forced by the government to participate in a homosexual wedding.” While those conservatives have been rightly ridiculed for failing to explain how the Indiana law as originally formulated would not license bigotry, critics can be equally chastised for failing to explain where to draw the line between religious freedom and discrimination. Asked on CNN this week whether a Jewish baker should have to make a cake for a KKK couple, Sarah Warbelow, legal director of the Human Rights Campaign, insisted that “there’s a huge difference between having to write something objectionable on a cake and being asked to provide a cake for a same sex couple.”

Of course, for some religious bakers, a cake with language or an image celebrating same-sex marriage is objectionable. In other words, critics may be trying to have their cake and eat it, too.

Consider two cases that both happen to involve bakeries in or near Denver, Colo. In July 2012, David Mullins and Charlie Craig visited Masterpiece Cakeshop to order a wedding cake. Owner Jack Phillips said that, due to his Christian beliefs, he could not provide a cake for the celebration of a same-sex marriage. Colorado’s Civil Rights Commission ultimately ruled that the bakery broke the state’s anti-discrimination laws.

Now, the flip side. In March 2014, Christian customer Bill Jack asked Azucar Bakery to prepare two cakes in the shape of Bibles — with an X over the image of two men holding hands. Owner Marjorie Silva said she would make the cakes but refused to include what she found to be an offensive message. Jack filed a religious discrimination claim that’s now pending with the state’s civil rights division.

Two sets of cakes. Two different sentiments viewed as offensive. Can we compel the baker in one case and permit the other to refuse? And should the right to refuse be limited to religious objections? There are an array of messages that offend non-religious persons or violate non-religious values. Glibly saying that you cannot discriminate ignores legitimate questions of forced speech and forced participation.

I’ve struggled with the tension between anti-discrimination laws and free speech/free exercise for years, and I see three basic approaches to resolving it:

Let them eat cake. As one option, we could maintain a strict neutrality rule that requires businesses to serve all customers, even when they find customers or their requests (whether involving cakes or flowers or photographs) to be offensive. If you choose to go into a particular business, you lose the ability to withhold services based on the content of messages or the specific attributes of an event. That would mean a bakery couldn’t refuse to inscribe an anti-gay message on a cake — or a birthday message to someone named Adolf Hitler Campbell (which a New Jersey ShopRite said no to a few years ago). Under this approach, a cake would be viewed as a form of speech of the customer, not the baker.

No cake for you. The second possibility is an absolute discretionary rule that allows businesses to decline services or products when they substantially burden religious values. This could lead to a significant rollback of this country’s progress since desegregation. Even the sponsors of the Indiana law have indicated that they do not want such a broad rule.

Speech-free cake. A third option would be to allow a limited exception for expressive services or products. Under this approach, a bakery could not refuse to sell basic cakes to anyone but it could refuse to customize cakes with objectionable symbols or words. A florist could not refuse to supply standard flower arrangements from a pre-set menu but could object to designing and styling, say, the venue of a same-sex event. Likewise, photographers — whose work is inherently expressive, as they select particular moments to capture, frame compositions and create a product tailored to specific clients — could claim an expressive exception in declining to work at events they find offensive.

Frankly, none of these options is entirely satisfying, and all three would lead to tough cases on the margins. For instance, the uniformity and clarity of the “let them eat cake” approach is appealing. Yet it’s hard to imagine compelling Jewish bakers to make Nazi cakes or African American bakers to make KKK cakes. On the other hand, if we allow for expressive exceptions, we’ll have to determine whether or not a funeral director, say, is engaged in an expressive act.

If we are unwilling to impose an absolute rule of service regardless of content, then we need to be honest about our reservations and look more closely at how to allow people to opt out of certain expressive services. If people can decline offensive services, we need to focus our attention on defining those services that are inherently expressive and those that are not. We need to discuss not the central issue of discrimination but those cases on the margins that deal with legitimate speech. As Benjamin Franklin noted, “a great empire, like a great cake, is most easily diminished at the edges.”

Jonathan Turley is the Shapiro Professor of Public Interest Law at George Washington University.

561 thoughts on “Critics of Indiana’s Religious Freedom Law Are Trying To Have Their Cake and Eat it, Too”

  1. It’s not about wedding cakes.

    Partly correct. It is about being forced to participate in a religious ceremony or a practice that is abhorrent to your religious principles.

  2. @WadWilliams

    Huh??? You said, “The Wing Nuts excel in manufacturing non-existent terrors.”????

    Uh, er, uh, like “OMG, gay people won’t be able to buy wedding cakes!!! WTF??? The pizza place theoretically wouldn’t cater a gay wedding!!! Oh, let’s boycott Indiana!!! Boycott the Final Four!!! Quick, somebody get Tim Cook out of the I-5 Rest Stop bathroom to make a proclamation!”

    You mean that kind of hysteria???

    Squeeky Fromm
    Girl Reporter

  3. Happy Abortion Cakes sell about as well as Iran Cakes – that is a big fat zero.

    The Wing Nuts excel in manufacturing non-existent terrors.

  4. Max-1 – “Jim22
    ps
    You’ll please notice that in my answer, I never suggested I’d turn them away…
    Deeply held convictions.”

    So you would force a Catholic baker to make the “Happy Abortion” cake?

  5. on 1, April 7, 2015 at 10:27 amPogo Hears a Who
    It is typical that in disagreements with a leftist, there first impulse is to describe their opponent as mentally ill.
    How Stalinist.

    **********************
    Yet Pogo ignores it when his buddy Spinelli does it almost daily. The double standard is quite evident.

  6. Yeah. Yeah. Right. All leftists who disagree are Stalinists.

    But tell me, Pogo. Do you believe that leftists are out to kill you and your family and want to destroy your business?

    1. Wade “No Question Will Be Answered” williams – if they kill Pogo and his family why would he care if they ruined his business? However, since I know what Pogo’s business is, I know the leftest communists are already trying to ruin it, then they will kill him and his wife.

  7. @ P HaW re “Non-Responsive Gibberish”

    PH:”The lefty (sic) answers to my posts are pretty typical nonresponsive gibberish.”

    PH: “The right (sic) has some serious concerns that warrant discussion, but the left (sic) offers only derision.”

    KR: “ ‘if you want to persuade anyone that there are legitimate reasons for opposing gay marriage, you’re going to have to present those reasons’

    PH:“I am not trying to persuade anyone. I am arguing that my religious and first amendment rights trump your right to coerce me to comply with participating in a gay marriage, lest you destroy my business and family.

    PH: “But I am also convinced that leftists (sic) will try to destroy me and other believers anyway.
    “That is their history.
    “It’s who they are, it’s what they do.”

    Rather than present reasons for your opposition to same-sex marriage, you emote effusively and fearfully about “leftist” plots and how those plotters “will try to destroy you and other believers.”

    You may characterize the above as “arguing,” but even granting wide latitude in defining argumentation, I’m sure I’m not alone in saying that what you’ve written above is much more accurately described as “non-responsive gibberish” with an explicit admission that you are “not trying to persuade anyone.”

  8. Echolalia. No – that’s not quite right. More like self-echolalia. Perhaps a bit too self-absorbed?

  9. “Stalin’s paranoia

    It is typical that in disagreements with a leftist, there first impulse is to describe their opponent as mentally ill.
    How Stalinist.

    But I repeat myself.

    1. Pogo – Stalin was paranoid and rightly so. He was probably murdered.

  10. Speaking of Stalin….

    Perhaps our self-certified ‘historian’ will comment on Stalin’s paranoia.

    And then we can try to ‘ferret’ out who around here believes that the leftists are out to kill him, his family and destroy his business.

    1. Ingannie

      The Vatican

      Lots of the Priests are actually Conscious. They give money to Science and knew all about the incorporation of the nature of the symbols of the Zodiac.

  11. HappyP, if I’ve hurt your feelings, I’m truly sorry, will you forgive me? I see God in you, I’ve said a few times here on these threads that you and Max are true examples of Christianity in action. For the fundamentalist Christians who don’t consider your beliefs or churches good enough or true enough…. Well that’s to be expected among fundamentalists.

    1. No Inga, that was because in the past I wanted to rid the thread of the Anarchist as his influence was warping everyone and I didn’t – It was never you. Whenever anyone says it is – I ignore them. Do you hear me? I ignore them. People that are on the right listen to authoritarian influences because that is what they do. They are often OCD and it puts the building blocks in their lives to hold things together and the rules are very necessary for them.

      They become dangerous when they turn around and hammer them on to those of us that do not operate by a Authoritarian Code except God. Their hypocrisies are dangerous because they are blind to them as they listen only to their leaders, Professors and Preachers. Any original thinking is lost in translation.

      What is dangerous by the same token about the progressive side imo, is the way the money is collected from the people and we are lied to by the Politicians and it is misused and misrepresended.

      The MSM is the one that is at fault for this on both ends of the spectrum as far as I am concerned as National Geographic has become nothing but a government Concern for Climate Change. They never mention when things are better such as the Fluorocarbons are better. They are teaching the Children in the Public Schools they are worse and they are not. I know this because my Friend with the Grandson I talk about all the time mentioned it and I send her a link so he could do a report. No side should be protected from wrong doing. We as a people must be vigilant and I know that you are and I see God in you also 😉

      http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-29152028

  12. Max, Karen often is blind to the abuse that is given to other commenters here by her fellow conservative commenters. I’m often shocked at that.

  13. happypappies
    “Lost my Children They didn’t want me back ”
    = = =
    I was that way with my mother and father, too. I lost my mom in 2007. We never really did reconnect. I’m trying to spend more time with my father but situations prevail. Stay strong.

    Peace.

  14. Jim22
    ps
    You’ll please notice that in my answer, I never suggested I’d turn them away…
    Deeply held convictions.

  15. happypappies,
    “and dwelt in the land of Nod”
    Nod must be another people God created yet Genesis omitted… Odd, NO?
    Omitted one of God’s creations… What purpose does that serve and who benefits by omitting a race of people from history?

  16. happypappies
    Max-1

    That would be the first case of Parthenogenesis-
    = = =
    Some call it Biblical Marriage…
    Seriously tho…
    Gen 4: 16 And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.

    17 And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.

    Seriously… “knew” means sexually. So, where did she come from? This is the first and only mention of her. After Abel, who was left BUT Cain’s father (Adam) and mother (Eve) according to the Bible. Yet, Cain “knew” his wife and she bore a son who had a son, who had a son, who had a son, etc. So, the women… where did they come from, especially Cain’s wife? Seriously. This is creation’s Achilles heel… If God created her, from what? From where? It is missing or omitted all together. Odd, since the story is of God’s creations. Is this Creation’s incest moment? Or beastiality moment? OR… evolution is truer than creationists even want to believe?

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