Washington Post: Warren Listed Herself As “American Indian” On Texas Bar Registration

The controversy over the past claims of Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren being a native American continued this week with a report in the Washington Post.  The Post reported that Warren claimed to be an “American Indian” on her Texas bar registration. Warren has denied claiming the status in her legal career despite being listed or referenced as a minority at a couple of law schools. This is a notable incident because it is a claim written in her own handwriting and was entirely unnecessary for registration in Texas.

Warren recently released a DNA test that showed a small possible fraction of Native American heritage. Stanford University Professor Carlos D. Bustamante is a respected academic in the field who has consulted on the national testing programs.

According to his report, Warren has a Native American ancestor from six to ten generations back. If Warren’s great-great-great-grandmother were Native American, she would be 1/32 Native American but it could date back further to 10 generations — making her only 1/1,024 Native American.  Even a 1/32 heritage may not translate into what most people would view as being Native American,  However Cherokee Nation principal chief Bill John Baker is 1/32 Cherokee by blood.  Warren claims Cherokee and Delaware heritage.

Warren touched off a firestorm with the release. Many noted that she degree of claimed DNA would make a huge number of people Native American. Moreover, tribal leaders were irate about using DNA as all. Cherokee Chuck Hoskin Jr., the tribe’s secretary of state, insisted “Using a DNA test to lay claim to any connection to the Cherokee Nation or any tribal nation, even vaguely, is inappropriate and wrong. Senator Warren is undermining tribal interests with her continued claims of tribal heritage.”

Much of this controversy has been baffling. There is no question that Warren was a successful and worthy academic in her own right. However, she has left something of a morass of different representations and rationalizations. I am still unclear why using DNA is such an offense but Warren apologized repeatedly for her test. I am also unclear on what the standard is for claiming Native American heritage if it is not based on blood line. Finally, I do not understand what level Warren is expected to meet to satisfy sufficient ancestry.

The card is damaging for Warren not in the sense that it gave her a professional advantage with the Bar but it shows that she claimed to be a minority without prompting or necessity.

166 thoughts on “Washington Post: Warren Listed Herself As “American Indian” On Texas Bar Registration”

  1. Orange GOP Man speaks a lie: BAD, BAD ORANGE MAN!!!

    Blond Progressive Woman lie in writing, identifying herself as a native indigenous persecuted person to get an awesome, prestigious, ultra high paid job @ Harvard, and resulting in Harvard using the lie in marketing material (omitting the 1000th of a percent ratio), and thus preventing a real native indigenous person from getting the job: GOOD, GOOD BLONDE PROGRESSIVE WOMAN!!!

  2. This is what JT considers important to write about today, after last night’s shameless vainglory mendacity tour? Trump is the best POTUS the ruble can buy. Why not write about all of the lies which have far more relevance than a bar application signed almost 33 years ago? Indisputable lies: El Paso was never one of the most-dangerous cities in the U.S. until a border fence was installed, according to the Sheriff and crime statistics. Secondly, illegal border crossings are at the lowest level since 1971. There is no emergency or crisis, other than with Fatso’s approval ratings. Third, despite all of the hype by the Liar-in-Chief, illegals commit far fewer murders, robberies, rapes, assaults and serious crimes per capita than native-born Americans. Fourth: most drugs are brought into the United States at ports of entry, not at locations where are aren’t walls. Fifth: ports of entry are understaffed for the amount of money that is already budgeted for such positions, much less at the higher staffing levels that Democrats want as part of their border security agenda. A recent confiscation of drugs attempted to be smuggled via a semi tractor trailer illustrates this point.

    Well, OK as to today’s post. First of all, do you have access to the instructions that accompanied this form? The instructions might have said to list ANY Native American ancestry, regardless of whether it is the majority of one’s ancestry. I’ve seen such instructions that come with such forms. What earthly difference does this make, other than to keep attacks on Senator Warren alive while ignoring far more relevant and timely lies such as those told by Trump last night.

    1. Get your own blog. The professor isn’t obligated to share your emotional problems and your fantasies.

      1. “judgment” has only one “e”. Meanwhile, do you have provable facts to disprove that Trump lied about the foregoing? According to one of his biographers, the only reason Trump reopened the government was because of his pathetic need for attention and glory. Nancy wouldn’t let him have his SOTU. Now that the SOTU is over, there’s little to stop him from doing it again because he’s still not going to get U.S. taxpayers to pay for the “big beautiful wall” he promised Mexico would pay for. Also, his disapproval rating is 57%.

        1. Nutchitchat sez “judgment” has only one “e”.”

          “Gainful employment” has two “e”s, and trolling for dollars has none

          Get a real job, Nutty. Your party is dying and you arent Heelping dem

          1. I was very confused (~ 4-5 days ago) why my MS Word was not automatically correcting “judgement” to “judgment.” But I did not care enough to look up why the auto-correct was not working for me. Now, I know why.

    2. Earth to readers: I double dare you to find a better lesson in Progressive hypocrisy in today’s inter webs: Let me interpret for “Late 4 the line where they hand out brains:” “I am all for facts and information, but not such that shines a negative light on Progressive lies, narcissism, and theft of jobs from true native indigenous persons. Please rather continue with the ORANGE MAN BAD MEME.

    3. The fine print on the form seems to ask a straitforward question about race.
      Whether Sen. Warren is 1/32 or 1/1032 Indian, she went with “American Indian” for whatever reason.
      Like Sen. Booker’s “Spartacus” moment, I don’t think she’s ever going to live down the Pocahontas taunts.
      Booker’s only hope is to announce that he’ll put Kirk Douglas on ticket if nominated😉

      1. The Stanford University DNA “expert” cited by JT doesn’t come across as much of an expert. He says that Warren is either 1/32 Cherokee (the same blood quantum as the current Chief of the Cherokee Nation), or 1/1,024. (The difference being whether the ancestor was six or 10 generations back.) Would four additional generations make that much of a difference? And why can’t the “expert” be more precise? I took a commercial DNA test and it was very precise about the relative DNA contributions of my ancestors.

        1. “I took a commercial DNA test and it was very precise about the relative DNA contributions of my ancestors.”

          And you havent a clue if its accurate.

          Yes 4 additional generations make a difference. The study of Genetics is a highly complicated discipline.

          https://www.amazon.com/Thompson-Genetics-Medicine/dp/1437706967/

          Read the classic Thompson Genetics textbook (if you can) and you will see the folly of commercial DNA tests

          Either way Sen Pocahontas was an idiot for going down this route and now she has to smoke her bitter pipe. Serves her right.

          1. I have to wonder when she first identified herself as an Indian. Her undergraduate institution (Univ of Houston) and law school (Rutgers) are not particularly selective, so maybe she was sitting there towards the end of her law school career, preparing her resume and wondering how she was going to get a job in the saturated attorney market, and thought to herself….”if only I had claimed to be a Cherokee, I could have gone to Harvard or Yale…..” 🤦‍♀️

            1. 😂😂😂

              If nothing else she and the chaos of the Dems are providing the nation a very nice respite.

              We need to laugh more, be outraged less

              1. “We need to laugh more, be outraged less”

                Estovir, you will have your chance. We saw what happened with Judge Moore. Then we saw what happened with Kavanaugh. Now the Dems have a mess. Three at the top of government are in trouble and the fourth top man is a Republican. The Dems have to act against someone.

                Do they get rid of the one’s who created awful pictures or the man that raped a woman based on Democratic standards. The lesser crime is the disgusting pictures and the greater crime is rape. But the rapist is black. How can the hypocrites in the Democratic party resolve this? Are they going to throw the black out or the two whites. I hate to talk that way but Democrats think in terms of tribes rather than we are all people, Americans, that should not be “judged by the color of” our “skin”, but by the content of” our “character.”

                Now we get to the fun part that starts with a bit of pain. Ginsberg will have to resign. Trump will be appointing someone from his list and my guess is that it will be Amy Barett. Trump’s pick of Kavanaugh was in part a gift to Democrats because he was one of those on the list that was least objectionable to the Democrats. Look at how he was savaged. Amy Barrett I believe is as close to an originalist as anyone on the list and will send the Dems into a rage like not seen before but what type of claims will they be able to make when just earlier 3 of their own committed the ultimate Democratic sins.

  3. The democrat race is going to be thoroughly entertaining. Who will win? Lying Pocahontas? Biden, the groper of females of all ages? Angry Kamala, the “black Hillary?” Beto, the irishman pretending to be a…lahhh-tino! The dem’s preferred candidate is a 29 year old communist bartender who can’t run.

    1. Who will be left in the Democrat leadership? Get a load of NOW demanding Virginia Lt Gov Justin Fairfax to resign …What a mortal blow.

      Maybe Virginia will secede from the Union again! 😜

      ###

      Justin Fairfax Must Resign – NOW Believes Survivors
      https://now.org/media-center/press-release/justin-fairfax-must-resign-now-believes-survivors/

      Statement by NOW President Toni Van Pelt
      02.06.2019

      WASHINGTON – The National Organization for Women (NOW) calls on Justin Fairfax to remove himself from the line of succession by resigning his office.

      Dr. Vanessa Tyson has made the brave decision to come forward and reveal in her own words what happened between her and Virginia Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax during the 2004 Democratic National Convention in Boston. Her story is horrifying, compelling and clear as day – and we believe her.

      We believe and support survivors. We always believe and support survivors.

      This is more important than who is going to be the next governor of Virginia. This isn’t about politics. It’s about a woman who has experienced sexual assault – a serious crime – at the hands of a powerful man, who is now attacking her character. In order to tear down the systemic and toxic sexism in this country, we must speak out against it.

      Enough is enough.

      Contact
      NOW Press , press@now.org , 202-628-8669

      1. “Maybe Virginia will secede from the Union again!”
        **********************

        Tried that. Lost our shirts. After that unpleasantness, we purged the slave-holding Democrats and elected Republicans to get back to even. Sounds like a good plan to me.

        1. “After that unpleasantness,…” can we re-implement the “manifest tenor” of the Constitution and the private sector charity industry, and eradicate affirmative action, welfare, food stamps, quotas, Obamacare, forced busing, rent control, utility subsidies, social services, WIC, HAMP, HARP, HUD, HHS, TANF, SSI, Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, Social Security Disability, “Fair Housing,” “Non-Discrimination,” “hate crime,” etc., etc., etc. once and for all? Can we, “Tear down this wall?”

          The idea was Freedom and Self-Reliance.

    2. So if Pervy Uncle Joe and Lying Pocohantas had a son, his name would be Chief Groapy Hands. If Beto O’Roarke and Angry Kamala had a son his name would be Juan Confused Dehli Deli. 😹😹😹

    1. Love it, mespo.
      Since Liz’s Cherokee “heritage” is possibly not a thing til you reach back to early late 18th or early 19th c, wouldn’t that put the “family” in North Carolina or Tennessee?
      She should have applied to one of their state schools for free tuition…. 😊

      1. Cindy Bragg:

        Our Boston Okie just got a little confused. She traces her lineage from Bhopal and her Indian heritage is decidedly Hindu not Hopi. Namaste’ Y’all!

        It’s what happens when you forget where you come from and who you are.

          1. mespo….my replies to you keep going rogue…..The Delhi one is down stream, I think.. Anyway, the Justin Moore video is a heart tugger.
            I wish our little town would stop growing….We don’t need more stinkin residents!

            1. Cindy:

              We call them “come heres” in Virginia. Or as I like to say about our brethren in our Northern Virginia colony: they’re 𝒊𝒏 Virginia not 𝒐𝒇 Virginia.

  4. WARREN’S MOMENT HAS COME & GONE

    Elizabeth Warren should have been Hillary’s Clinton’s running mate on an All-Girl ticket in 2016. But that didn’t happen. Consequently Warren is now an aging, less attractive candidate who is likely to be forgotten in the next presidential race.

    One should pause to note that recent history has not been kind to presidential candidates from Massachusetts. John Kennedy may not have actually won in 1960. Michael Dukakis got blown-out in 1988. John Kerry lost in 2004 and Mitt Romney lost in 2012.

    My theory is that Massachusetts, a one-city state, is too far north and too far east. Consequently most Americans outside New England think of Massachusetts as an isolated corner of the country. What’s more, Boston’s image as America’s academic capitol is synonymous with ‘elitism’ among the less-educated.

    1. Elizabeth Warren should have been Hillary’s Clinton’s running mate on an All-Girl ticket in 2016.

      Why? The Vice Presidency is a witless 5th wheel job and people only take it for the exposure. There are two things advisable in a VP: the capacity to take the reins of government on short notice (Pence, Kaine, Cheney, Lieberman, Bentsen, Bush the Elder, and Mondale had that; the rest, no); and no skeletons in the closet. Warren’s lying for professional advancement might be ess embarrassing than all the gangsters in Geraldine Ferraro’s social circle and might be less embarrassing than Thomas Eagleton’s shock treatments. Still not what you want.

  5. Juana,..
    If you immigrated here legally, you don’t really have any reason to shudder.
    Or if you came to the U.S. illegally, you’re probably still OK if you live in California or a similar area.
    There are only very rough estimates of the total number of immigrants who are not legal residents of the U.S., and there does not seem to be a serious overall effort to either track those numbers, or even consider immigration status in cases of criminal conduct.
    I grew up in neighborhoods that had a relatively large Hispanic population in a smaller community (c.25,000).
    There was really no “segregation”, most of them were to one degree or another established residents, and most spoke at least basic English well.
    There were seasonal migrant agricultural workers who entered on work permits and returned to Mexico as the harvests, etc. ended.
    One classmate and his family, all citizens, would still work the fields seasonally and this guy would be excused if he started the school year a little late because of harvest.
    They had a rural housing development for their temporary stays in those seasons, and the biggest problem seemed to be that they’d get drunk after a week of hard field work, and get caught driving the 5-6 miles back to the labor camp.
    It seems like most of these guys would have picked up on the fact that the road home for them was heavily patrolled on the weekends, but
    Then, there was virtually no problem with gangs, drug houses, drive-by shootings, parking lot melees involving rival groups of totaling 50-60 warriors with clubs, chains, boards, etc.
    That has changed dramatically over the past c.25 years. There’s really no way of knowing “who’s doing what” when it comes to determining how many of those involved in these kinds of activities are here legally or illegally.
    If anyone or any agency is bothering to track those numbers and making any kind of distinction between the crime rate of legal v. illegal residents.
    A friend who was raising a family in a nearby community where similar problems were getting out of hand actually relocated to another town.
    He noted that when he picked up the newspaper and looked at the arrest reports and court cases, those reports was overwhelmingly dominated by Hispanic names.
    I doubt if he had any way of knowing how many of those were here legally or not, and that wouldn’t have influenced his decision to move his family in any case.
    Anyway, when the overall crime rate in a community spikes, and a highly disproportionate spike in that rate is coming primarily from one ethnic minority, people take notice.
    There is the “why is that” part of the question, and the question of “who if anyone” is actually tracking and paying attention to who is here legally and who is not.
    However sloppily and stupidly Trump phrased his take on illegal immigration as a candidate, he hit on something that is a noticeable issue.

    1. Tom, who is Jauna and why are you citing anecdotal evidence instead of hard stats? And dare I ask how this relates to Elizabeth Warren?

      1. Some Latina nutjob whose crazy rant is posted at the bottom of the thread. She should seriously consider relocating back to Mexico.

      2. # 1.
        You have as good of an idea or answer for the “who is Juana?” question as I would.
        People don’t run their biographies past me when they post here.

        #2.
        I mentioned the lack of any serious effort to monitor and record crimes committed by legal v. Ilegal U.S. residents.
        That’s one reason why I was “citing anecdotal evidence”, in the absence of any reliable statistics I have seen.
        Another reason is that the young couple in the house I grew up in in the 1960s were both shot and wounded as they were leaving in their car; that neighborhood is now exclusively Hispanic, and both the victims and the shooter were Hispanic.
        Another reason is my former next door neighbor’s house ( I lived there in the 1980s) was the scene of a double homicide….the couple in their 30s were gunned down as they sat on their porch.
        Again, Hispanic shooters, Hispanic victims.
        She had the same last name as one of the previous residents/ owners of that same house…..I knew the guy and his two brothers pretty well, we used to drink beer together at the same bar.
        I’ve lost track of them over the years, but the young woman was probably related to the three brother.
        I could cite other “anecdotal evidence” involving that community and other nearby community, but I know that “hard stats” are better.
        Maybe California us a good place to find those “hard stats”, since I’m sure that jurisdiction really busts its butt
        distinguishing between the legal and illegal immigrant population.

        #3.
        You can track the course of the exchanges in these threads if you read them, and understand what is in them.
        I think it was Paul? who mentioned a. Warren’s non-existent chance of being elected.
        Which led to b. me posting the 2020 presidential odds in response,
        which in turn led to c. Juana’s reply to me about Trump’s remarks about illegal immigration.
        I hope that review of those exchanges helps to clear up your confusion.

        1. Tom, the jails and prisons know how many undocumented criminals are locked up. Even California keeps those stats. But is building a hard wall going to alter those stats?

          One has to pause here for two questions:

          1) How tall would the wall have to be to prevent laddering over?

          2) How ‘deep’ would the wall have to be to prevent tunneling under?

          To my knowledge no one has exact measurements on this. It harks back to that old saying: “Where there’s will there’s a way”.

          This reminds of a seminar I once attended at the Chicago Police Academy. The instructor was giving a history of burglar alarm systems. In giving said history the instructor deliberately fell into a rhythmic pattern that went like this: “The alarm companies came out with alarms that blah blah blah. Then burglars figured-out they could trick the alarms with blah blah blah..”. The instructor went on for several minutes detailing every development and how the burglars adapted.

          Aside from effectiveness, the wall raises another question: “Can we really build a comprehensive wall for only $5.6 billion. Of course not. That funding might only build small sections. And perhaps only small sections are needed. But will Trump be satisfied with small sections? Or will he keep coming back and asking for more until this becomes a $30 billion project? For that much money we could build and upgrade huge amounts of infrastructure which this country desperately needs.

          In the long run those infrastructure projects would benefit the country more than a hard wall which smugglers might easily adapt to.

          1. You should tell Israel how stupid and immoral and RAYCIS they are for building a wall around their nation. Are those Israelis STUPID?

              1. Peter, your mind doesn’t seem able to think. you are comparing Israel’s border wall with the border wall the US requires. When you take land area into account Israel’s wall is huge and probably would dwarf any wall the US is considering building even if it extended over the entire border with Mexico. Next Peter think poulation and one will likely find that per person the US would have a small wall.

                Someone should do those calculations. When completed the border wall/ fence in Israel I think will be a tad less than 450 miles. Israel’s area is close to that of New Jersey.

                PEOPLE: DO NOT TAKE ANYTHING PETER SAYS SERIOUSLY. HE IS ALMOST ALWAYS WRONG.

                1. Alan, 450 miles ain’t much with regards to the U.S. Mexican border. A second question might be: “How many Palestinians live on the West Bank?” And, “How many people live in Central America?”

                  1. Peter, you don’t seem able to evaluate things. NJ is about the size of Israel so of course 450 miles seems small compared to the Mexican border. But when one looks at the size of the nation 450 is huge because if Israel were the equivalent of 4-5 New Jerseys its wall would have to be as big as the US Mexican border. New Jersey ,in case you don’t know, is rather small.

                    “How many Palestinians live on the West Bank?”

                    Firstly the West Bank is only part of the border Israel shares so that statement discloses a bit of ignorance on your part.

                    Then you wish a comparison: “How many people live in Central America?”

                    The Israeli wall is there to block terrorists from all over the middle east though substantially directed against Gaza where you have likely seen a wall, tunnelling and fighting, but the wall is also to protect against illegal immigration from Africa along with terrorists coming across the Egyptian border that Egypt fights as well. There are two more borders, Syria and Lebanon. There are two major terrorist groups Hamas and Hezbollah both armed and supported by Iran. There are about 150,000 missiles pointed at Israel from these two areas where the most sophisticated of the weapons come from Iran which was supported by the Obama administration which gave them $150 Billion and then a plane load of cash all used to prop up the people that pledge to destroy AMERICA and create a nuclear missile to be launched at Israel. To top it off the Obama administration helped that horrid regime to enslave the Persian people.

                    The wall has put almost a complete stop to illegal immigrants enterring Israel and has saved the lives of many of its citizens.

                    Peter, it is obvious why you quote from the Washington Post. You don’t know much of anything.

                    By the way to put things in perspective the number of illegal aliens in the US is between more than the population of Israel and 3 times its population.

              2. Petrol Shill, why are you discussing the Mexican border when the JT column is clearly about Senator Warren?

                Medicine womyn needs your help.

                ###

                https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/06/politics/elizabeth-warren-native-american/index.html

                Elizabeth Warren’s Native American problem just got even worse
                Warren: I’m not a member of an American Indian tribe

                (CNN) — For months, Elizabeth Warren has struggled to get from under the muddled — and occasionally contradictory — story she has told about her own belief in her Native American heritage, and whether she ever either claimed that background on documents or received any sort of advantage from it.

                On Tuesday, Warren’s claims took a major hit: The Washington Post reported on a Texas bar registration card from 1986 in which, clearly and apparently in her own hand, the Massachusetts Democrat had written “American Indian” when asked to identify her race.
                Neither Warren nor her office denied either the authenticity of the document nor that it was the senator’s signature on it. “I can’t go back,” Warren told the Post in an interview Tuesday. “But I am sorry for furthering confusion on tribal sovereignty and tribal citizenship and harm that resulted.”

                Here’s why this all matters so much: Prior to the Post’s report of this bar registration card, Warren had maintained some level of plausible deniability about claiming herself as a Native American. As the Post wrote:

                “The Texas bar registration card is significant, among other reasons, because it removes any doubt that Warren directly claimed the identity. In other instances Warren has declined to say whether she or an assistant filled out forms.”

                When the story initially broke WAY back during Warren’s 2012 Senate campaign, it was reported that Warren had been listed as a minority in a faculty directory at Harvard Law School — and had been part of the school’s touting of its diversity. At the time, Warren and her campaign insisted that she was unaware that her background was being touted by Harvard — and had never asked them to do so.
                When subsequent stories emerged about Warren being listed as a Native American in a similar faculty directory at the University of Pennsylvania, the Warren team gave the same answer. She wasn’t aware of the listing — and certainly never gained any benefit from it.

                A richly reported Boston Globe investigation concluded that Warren was correct in her claim that she had never gained professionally from being listed as a Native American. But the larger question over her heritage lingered.
                The answer to that is still fuzzy. Last October, Warren released a five-minute video designed to settle the controversy once and for all — and before she announced for president.
                But it did no such thing. First of all, it rehashed much of what Warren had previously said about her claims of having Native American ancestry — that she had been told by her family that her ancestors were American Indians. Second, it tried to hang the verification of her claims on a DNA test that suggested she might have had Native American ancestors six to 10 generations ago.

                Not only was that something short of foolproof evidence, but it also angered the Cherokee Nation, which argued that defining ethnicity via DNA and bloodlines was a dicey proposition.

                Last week, seemingly out of the blue, Warren apologized to the tribe for using the DNA test as an attempt to prove her heritage. That apology makes much more sense in light of the Post reporting on Tuesday.
                What we now know is that Warren actively identified as a Native American as far back as 1986. This was not some mix-up or misunderstanding or someone who worked for Warren making a mistake. This was Warren’s doing.

                That still doesn’t mean that she gained anything from her decision to call herself a Native American on some documents. The bar registration card is a simple formality, not the sort of thing that would somehow benefit Warren in some material way.

                But what it does mean is that Warren’s efforts to clear all of this up before she officially becomes a presidential candidate — she’s in the exploratory committee phase now — have failed and failed miserably.

                A big part of presidential campaigns is introducing yourself to voters who don’t know you. And the best way to do that is to tell them the story of your life — how you came to a place where you believe you are best equipped to represent a nation of more than 300 million people.

                That back story is hopelessly compromised for Warren now. Every time she talks about growing up or her life before this presidential race, it will dredge up the (ongoing) controversy over why she claimed to be Native American despite very iffy evidence of that claim. She won’t be able to escape it. It will be in every story about her past — and in most voters’ minds when they think about which candidate to support.

                Given that Donald Trump is President of the United States, nothing is impossible in politics. So Warren could somehow put all of this behind her, somehow, and be the nominee. But there’s no question that her path to the Democratic presidential nomination has grown significantly steeper since last October. And the incline got even more pitched on Tuesday.

                1. Que Vadis, I ‘did’ address Elizabeth Warren. She’s not my senator and I have no investment in her.

                  And ‘who’ are you, anyway??? Someone we’ve known by another name..???

          2. https://thehill.com/opinion/immigration/407312-one-in-five-us-prison-inmates-is-a-criminal-alien
            Peter,…
            I don’t know what the statistics are re those California records kept about inmates who were arrested for crimes while in the U.S. illegally.
            There would probably be a need to factor in undocumented criminals who were deported for acts related to crimes, IF the particular California juridiction cooperates with federal agencies in cases that warrant deportation.
            The article that I provided a link to gives some idea of nationwide stats.
            The people who need to be front and center in the debate over “the wall” are the border patrol personnel, law enforcement agencies, immigration officials, judges, etc.—– not Donald Trump or Nancy Pelosi or Chuck Schumer.
            They are, of course, the sector least heard from.
            I would be inclined to be influenced more by their input than anyone else’s.
            I think Sen. McCain was the one saying that “if you build a 20 foot wall, they’ll just use a 22 foot ladder”.
            Since any barrier can be circumvented, then taking that mindset to it’s logical stretching point, there should be no type of border barriers anywhere , since they can all potentially be breeched.
            As a sidenote, I noticed Natacha’s claims when I skimmed these comments a few minutes ago, but I did not see any supporting documentation for those claims.
            I’ll have to re-read them once I post this, to see if she provided any sources.

            1. Kurtz, what’s your interest in this, anyway..?? Illinois is LOSING population. Chicago is also LOSING population. The population of Chicago’s metro region has been stagnant for 30 years. One could argue that Chicago could use some immigrants. What’s more, there are several cities big and small across the Midwest that could use immigration to beef up their populations.

              Now of course you want immigrants with good job skills. And that would be ideal. But declining populations are not a good, longterm trend for any city, metro region or state.

          3. President Obama subsidized solar and other renewable energy in the United States with taxpayer money to the tune of $39 billion per year on average for the past 5 years. These massive subsidies, however, have done little to increase the contribution of solar power to the electricity generation mix as solar is expected to produce just 0.6 percent of electricity generation this year.[i] Disregarding the cost to the American taxpayer and the failed solar projects in the United States, President Obama has pledged billions of dollars to fund solar energy development in India. On his trip to India, President Obama was hoping to bring back a deal similar to the one he made in China to peak the country’s carbon dioxide emissions by 2030. However, Prime Minister Narendra Modi rejected the President’s proposed global warming deal, realizing his priority should be to bring power to the hundreds of millions of Indians that lack access to electricity.[ii] India’s Prime Minister knows that it needs all forms of electricity generation, including coal, to accomplish this goal.

            Study by the Taxpayers Protection Alliance

            The Taxpayers Protection Alliance produced a report highlighting information from various studies on the U.S. subsidization of solar power. Over the last 5 years, taxpayers spent over $150 billion on solar power and other renewable projects, financing grants, subsidizing tax credits, guaranteeing loans, and bailing out failed solar energy companies, according to the Brookings Institute. According to the Government Accountability Office, federal government support for solar energy is massive, with over 345 different federal initiatives covering over 1,500 projects in 20 federal agencies–the Pentagon has 63 solar programs, the highest among the agencies, followed by the Interior Department, with 37 programs and the Energy Department (DOE) with 34 solar programs. For example, DOE’s Sunshot Initiative spends $270 million per year to “induce companies to lower production and installation costs associated with photovoltaic solar panel systems and reducing the price of solar power.” Last month the Energy Department announced an additional $59 million for “solar deployment plans.”[iii]

            States also have also heavily subsidized the solar industry by offering tax breaks and 538 rebate programs. Twenty states have personal tax credits related to solar products, 18 states have corporate tax credit and deduction programs, and 14 states and Puerto Rico offer taxpayer-funded grants to support solar electricity. The 538 different state and local green energy rebate programs are intended to reduce the final cost of products including solar water heaters and grid-connected rooftop solar panels.

            The 2009 stimulus package provided an estimated $51 billion for renewable energy projects, including funding for failed solar energy companies like Solyndra and Abound Solar. The Obama Administration gave Solyndra a $535 million loan guarantee to manufacture solar panels, but the company had to file for bankruptcy in 2011. Abound Solar received a $400 million federal loan guarantee, but its product was defective, producing only a fraction of its intended wattage, with solar panels catching on fire. It filed for bankruptcy in 2012 after using $70 million in taxpayer-backed loans; the bankruptcy cost taxpayers an estimated $60 million, and cleaning up the toxic solar panels cost an additional $2.2 million. First Solar received over $3 billion in loan guarantees in September 2011. Three months later, First Solar cut over 150 jobs and then followed that with an announcement 3 months later that it was laying off 2,000 additional workers – 30 percent of its workforce – and selling off much of its $3 billion in federal loan guarantees to third parties. The Ivanpah Solar Electric Generating System in California, a concentrated solar thermal plant, received $1.6 billion in subsidies, but produces electricity at a rate of only 25 to 40 percent of original estimates and at a cost three times higher than traditional power. Because electricity production at Ivanpah is lower than expected, resulting in lower than expected revenues, it has requested an additional $539 million of taxpayers’ money from the federal government to pay a portion of the loan that taxpayers funded.

            According to the Daily Caller, “the federal government has spent more per year on solar power and other green energy programs in the last five years than it did on securing U.S. embassies. The State Department spent $2.7 billion on “embassy security, construction and maintenance” in 2014—over 14 times less than what the federal government spent on so called “green projects,” and President Obama’s 2016 budget proposal is requesting less for 2016—$2.2 billion.[iv]

            1. Alan, Trump’s efforts to prop-up the coal industry are ridiculous. The Solar Industry now employs more people than coal.

              Why is Trump clinging to horse & buggy technologies..??? And ‘why’ are you claiming Solar is a bust..?? It’s not. Only in the right-wing media bubble is Solar a bust. Outside that bubble coal is OLD technology.
              ………………………………………………………………………………………………….

              Energy Secretary Rick Perry’s proposal to force electricity customers to subsidize ailing coal plants ran aground early this year. The Senate rebuffed efforts to water down tax credits for solar and wind power. And Trump’s move this week to impose a tariff on imported solar panels should put only a crimp in the growth of sun-powered energy, analysts have said, despite the outcry it’s generated from most of the U.S. solar industry.

              Trump spent his campaign promoting an “America First” energy policy that translated to more oil, gas and especially coal — even as he slammed solar as expensive and hammered wind turbines as ugly. But after growing rapidly during the Obama years, wind and solar energy may have come too far for even a pro-fossil-fuel administration to stuff back into the barrel — especially after creating tens of thousands of jobs in red and blue states alike.

              The solar industry now employs 260,000 people and has become one of the fastest-growing energy sectors. Together, wind and solar power make up most of the new power capacity added to the U.S. grid in recent years. The Solar Energy Industries Association says the tariffs imposed Monday will cost the industry 23,000 jobs, but even CEO Abigail Ross Hopper said the 30 percent tariff was not as bad as it could have been, since Trump could have imposed a 50 percent tariff.

              Since solar cells and panels make up only a fraction of a new solar system’s costs, analysts expect the tariffs to bump up overall installed prices by 6 percent for residential rooftops and about 10 percent for utility-scale plants. Rocky Mountain Institute’s own analysis says that the ongoing decline in solar installation costs will wipe out the price increases from the tariff in 18 months.

              Republicans in the House last year tried to use last year’s tax bill to eliminate provisions that allow an existing wind power subsidy called the Production Tax Credit to climb with inflation, and would have shortened the length of solar tax benefits called the Investment Tax Credit. The two moves alarmed advocates, which, along with other tweaks, could have devastated renewables development. But Senate tax writers removed the provisions in the conference, and renewables kept their credits.

              Still, rule changes in the tax bill did weaken the market used to finance some renewable projects. And the wind tax credit will phase down to zero, and the solar credit to 10 percent by 2020.

              The administration’s most ambitious effort so far to tilt the scale in the direction of traditional fuels came from the Energy Department last fall, when Perry invoked a rarely used authority to press federal energy regulators to create a subsidy for a group of coal-fired and nuclear power plants in markets stretching from the Midwest to the East Coast. The move would have propped up plants that are struggling to survive in the face of rising natural gas and wind power.

              But Perry’s proposal was rejected by all five members of the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission, four of whom had been appointed by Trump. The independent agency said DOE’s push for the rule wasn’t justified by conditions in the power markets, though it agreed to study the issue.

              While oil and natural gas companies have applauded Trump’s policies to open new areas for them to explore, conservative groups that typically support those industries have been loath to support administration plans to prop up coal or impose trade barriers they say violate free-market principles. But they have backed Trump’s plans to dismantle Obama’s climate and pollution regulations for power plants.

              “We don’t like picking winners and losers,” said Myron Ebell, director of the Center for Energy and Environment at the conservative Competitive Enterprise Institute. “I am concerned that at least on the margins, the administration seems interested in picking winners and losers. I’m not worried overall. It seems to me the main thrust of policy is getting government out of decision-making.”

              Edited from: ‘Trump’s Failing War On Green Power”

              POLITICO, 1/24/18

              1. Peter, you make one stupid statement after another and then try to embellish it with a hit piece.

                The discussion hinged on your statement that everyone agreed on climate change. I demonstrated that what you said was untrue.

                “And ‘why’ are you claiming Solar is a bust..?? ”

                That is not what is claimed. Solar investments of billions of dollars by Obama were a bust. Solar itself has good uses and is developing. I put solar into two of my homes. It was great for a swimming pool and lousy to heat the water as the repairs and replacements cost so much for the latter. Too much hassel, but it did work for the swimming pool. The solar for the heater added to the junk heap and costs to our environment.

                What is it about you that wants to keep poor people poor and cold?

                1. Alan, you don’t say how long ago it was that you put those solar systems in. Whatever..!!

                  Whether it’s caused by carbon emissions or just a ‘cyclical occurrence’, Climate Change is causing real changes.

                  Those changes don’t have to be a crisis if we start preparing. If we make it a national priority to plan for Climate Change, we might create numerous jobs and opportunities.

                  But if we keep denying Climate Change, there will come a tipping point where we don’t have enough time to plan or adjust. At that point America could literally go bankrupt as monster storms batter our cities faster than we can repair.

                  Therefore it’s tragic that Trump keeps the country focused on a stupid wall that might never be effective. The average Joe on Main Street will never benefit. It’s just red meat to Trump’s base and that’s what it’s all about.

                  1. “Whether it’s caused by carbon emissions or just a ‘cyclical occurrence’, Climate Change is causing real changes.”

                    Correct. Climate change is part of the world we live in. At this time we cannot alter the major things that cause our climate to be what it is. The earth spins on an axis around the sun and doesn’t travel in a circle rather an elipse that has aberrancies. The sun keeps us warm but is not static. We are controlled by these factors and others not the other way around.

                    “Those changes don’t have to be a crisis if we start preparing. If we make it a national priority to plan for Climate Change, we might create numerous jobs and opportunities.”

                    Really? Tell us what you are preparing for and how your preparation can counteract a sudden shift in the earth’s orbit. Jobs? We can create jobs by breaking windows and putting new windows in. How is that helpful?

                    “But if we keep denying Climate Change, there will come a tipping point where we don’t have enough time to plan or adjust.”

                    You sound like a man that runs around without a head. Maybe nothing needs to be done. One day the sun will burn out and the earth will be cool. Do you wish to start building a new sun right now, in advance? I don’t think you have any understanding about the subject matter. You have been told the sky is falling and now are running around repeating that statement.

                    In the end you link climate change to building a wall to keep illegals, drugs, and criminals out. I don’t know how more foolish anyone can sound.

          4. Peter tell Obama to: ‘take down your wall’, and then tell all the other nuts that have huge walls protecting their homes and other properties to ‘take down their walls’. It’s amazing how only the middle class workers can’t afford walls but have to put up such dumb statements from the elite and those working people without common sense.

  6. Also as a nation that wants respect for our laws of belonging and not-belonging, we should respect other nations. The Indian nations are American, but, among us, they represent quasi sovereign entities who may lawfully define their own polity. Thus, if they say she is not a member, that is decisive.

    She is shown to be a grasping and deceitful person on a very material issue: that of social identity. And thus she should not be seriously considered as a candidate anymore.

    I recommend Democrats take a good look at good looking Tulsi Gabbard instead.

    1. No, one can be an American Indian by race and not an enrolled member of a tribe. If I married a full-blooded Cherokee, for example, and we had a child and I chose not to, or didn’t get around to registering the child with the tribe, he/she would nonetheless still be an A.I. by ethnicity. And during the 1950s the government had a program of “terminating” tribes, by which the government would make a cash payment in exchange for permanently expunging the tribe from Bureau of Indian Affairs rolls. Many impoverished Indians took the money and were thereafter struck from the rolls. The federal government deems “Indian” as a legal status, not an ethnic one. Thus if you are an Indian whose tribal status (or that of your ancestors) was either never recognized, or terminated, or you are not registered with a tribe, then you are not acknowledged as Indian. But universities and employers consider A.I. as a matter of blood and self-identification, not who is on a list with the BIA in Washington.

    2. The Democrats would do well to find an experienced executive for whom electoral politics has been a 2d career, who takes an interest in public policy, who knows where the washrooms are in Congress, who isn’t hostile to law enforcement or vernacular American culture, and who knows that the bulk of the discourse in the Democratic Party is humbug. Trouble is, Harry Truman died in 1972.

  7. Another blog has a story which says that Warren’s great great grand parents were slave owners somewhere in the South up until the end of the Civil War. And grand parents were in the KKK.

    1. Liberty,..
      – I hadn’t thought about until you mentioned it, but were all of those white-robed women that I saw at the SOTU address part of the Klan’s woman auxiliary?
      Or were they members of some other cult?

        1. Ouch! That was bad timing and bad taste if the gals-in-white were showing solidarity with Gov. Northam😉.
          Probably counter-productive for him, as well.

      1. “Some of the national women’s patriotic societies that later folded into the WKKK included the Ladies of the Invisible Eye, Dixie Protestant Women’s Political League, Grand League of Protestant Women, White American Protestants (WAP), and Ladies of the Invisible Empire.

        On June 10, 1923, many Protestant patriotic women’s organizations combined to form the first membership of the Women of the Ku Klux Klan in Little Rock, Arkansas. Starting with 125,000 members, the WKKK spread quickly to thirty-six states, growing its national membership to more than 1 million women by 1924.”

        –Brenner, Betty Jo. “Women of the Ku Klux Klan.” Colorado Encyclopedia,

        Hey, Ladies of the Invisible Eye, want to meet the Grand One Eyed Cyclops?”

  8. Since the Court abandoned equal treatment under the law in the name of Diversity, it is hardly surprising that we find grasping opportunists trying to claim minority status. It does cast doubt on one’s character. The bar association card probably did not give her an immediate advantage but it did help build the backstory that I suspect gave her career a considerable advantage as a ‘woman of color’ at Harvard. She has to hope the full Harvard record never comes out. I could never vote for her for any office.

  9. I’m not really sure why this matters. We see people claiming to be black with no significant or apparent black ancestry. Kamala Harris is “black” when it suits her interests despite being raised in Canada by a mother who is a native of India. Ben Jealous, former president of the NAACP is another “black” with a white father who was raised in a wealthy white seaside community in CA. Shaun King, who founded Black Lives Matter is the son of a wealthy executive, and is so white that he is derisively called “Talcum X.” Point being, is that when it comes to blacks, people with very little black blood, and no connection whatsoever to the black American experience, can not only claim to be black, but can become leaders, due to the fact that they were raised with the advantages of wealthy, educated whites or Asians. Then they swoop in and resurrect their “blackness” to professional and political advantage. Elizabeth’s Warren’s bar registration, by the very terms printed on it, was supposed to be confidential and gained her no professional advantage. So if she wants to identify with some remote aspect of her ancestry, why should it matter?

    1. She obviously wanted advantages granted to racial minorites. It exposes the spoils system of quotas, setasides, scholarships, etc which are perks the system hands out to minorities to enlist their support.

      It’s tempting for white folks. There’s a lot of white Hispanics out there on that bandwagon too, checking the boxes on their applications since they had a “Latino” grandparent even though 3/4 of their ancestors are no such thing and nobody has oppressed them whatsoever…… Asians don’t get much however since they are manifestly smart and hardworking as a group.

      https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/04/us/harvard-asian-admission.html

      EQUALITY in America means “GIVING UNEQUAL BENEFITS TO CERTAIN MINORITES AT THE EXPENSE OF WHITE PEOPLE AND ASIANS”

      So can you blame people for wanting to disown their white racial identity?

      Do they want to be part of the historical oppressor group, now designated for persecution?

      I guess it’s up to people to figure out what team they’re on, anyways, kind of like Tin said.

      1. But the problem is the system that rewards people based on race, not the individuals who are tempted to exaggerate their “one drop” in order to gain an education or a job. The system is corrupt, so I don’t have a problem with people gaming it to their advantage.

    2. “…and gained her no ‘professional’ advantage. So if she wants to identify with some remote aspect of her ancestry, why should it matter?”

      Why? Because exposing this now gives someone else ‘political’ advantage. Duh.

      Ask the oppo research team who dug this up. They’ll tell you. Hint: it’s probably because somebody named Kamala really wants to be POTUS. And Kamala’s ‘black-ish-ness’ trumps Liz’s ‘woo-woo Indian-ish-ness’ 😉

    3. “…and gained her no professional advantage. So if she wants to identify with some remote aspect of her ancestry, why should it matter?

      Why? Because exposing this now gives someone else a political advantage. Was this dug up by Kamala’s oppo research team? Who did the digging? Hmmm, gotta wonder…

      1. Doh! Sorry for the double post TIN. There was a delay in the first comment showing up and I thought it did not go thru so I tried again, and then both showed up!

        1. So someone who works for the State Bar of Texas sold a confidential registration card to the press? Sounds ripe for investigation and prosecution.

          1. And who says it’s confidential? Other than the code numbers, there’s no data there which isn’t published in Martindale-Hubbell.

            1. Did you actually read the card? Immediately preceding the question asking for ethnicity and disability (if any), it reads: “The following information is for statistical purposes only and will not be disclosed to any person or organization without the express written consent of the attorney.” Hmmm, that sounds kind of confidential to me….

              1. [chuckles]. The only data after that line is her signature, the date and the sham race / ethnicity she publicly claimed in other circumstances.

  10. We need to spend trillions of dollars on Global Warming because everyone knows it’s true.

    Yea, I’m going to take a pass on that one.

    1. I think you’ve confounded Warren with Shamala. Warren isn’t notably nasty, just another academic poseur. (And the smart money says the real sociopath is Kristen Gillibrand).

  11. What this tells you is that the Bezos Birdcage Liner is backing one of the other candidates. Perhaps Beto or Shamala.

  12. and she calls us evil? Worse she wants to be in charge of our economy and our money and yet has some kind of equally phony degree given to those who don’t understand what the words ‘money’ and ‘weatlh’ mean. First time I ever heard a dog whistle for itself.

    1. “and she calls us evil?” Of course. Anyone that opposes her is evil because they are on the wrong side of her thoughts. If you agree with her then you can say anyway you want because your thoughts are pure.

      The odds of Elizabeth being prez are pretty close to zero. She will just be noise in the background to confuse a few million and quite possibly allow the trump to be elected again. The demos are in a very poor state at the moment.

      1. She speaketh with fork tongue.

        ###

        “Elizabeth Warren is worth millions”

        Senator Elizabeth Warren fights for middle- and working-class Americans. But she’s part of the Top 1%.

        Warren, the Harvard bankruptcy law professor elected to the Senate in 2012, is worth between $3.7 million and $10 million.

        That’s not including the three-story Victorian home in Cambridge, Mass., that she owns with her husband and fellow Harvard law professor, Bruce Mann. It’s now assessed at $1.9 million, according to city property records.

        While she’s not in the uppermost wealth echelon of Congress, she’s not doing too badly either. Roll Call recently ranked her the 76th wealthiest out of 541 senators and representatives, based on her minimum net worth in 2013.

        Her average net worth of $8.75 million, including her home, secures her a spot the Top 1% bracket in terms of wealth.

        Congressional rules require lawmakers to file annual disclosure reports. The values are given as a range.

        The senator declined to comment on her wealth, a spokesman said.”

        https://money.cnn.com/2015/01/08/news/economy/elizabeth-warren-wealth/index.html

          1. Maybe she profited from some good investments, wrote a book, won the lottery and/or married well. Financial success often allows people the freedom to pursue other interests; in her case, politics. I have no problem with that at all.

      2. https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/us-politics/us-presidential-election-2020/winner
        Paul,…
        –The oddsmakers put Warren as a 25-to-1 underdog.
        Kind of interesting to check these odds from time to time.
        I think Hillary and Ace Avenetti are tied as 50:1 underdogs.
        Trump’s average odds from different sites, and at different times, have average 5:2 odds… meaning a 40% chance of winning in 2020.
        Fortunately, those who previously had a visceral hatred of Trump have come around to accepting that he may be around longer than they had hoped.
        Some, like Natacha in these threads, are indicating that they’d even welcome and embrace a second Trump term.😉☺😂

        1. Interesting that Oprah and Christine Ballsey Ford are tied as 100:1 longshots.
          I think Gov. Moonbeam is also in there at or about 100:1

        2. Tom, as an immigrant Latina I shuddered when I heard Trump utter the despicable things he said about Hispanics as a candidate before the Rep primaries. I thought “surely Americans would never pick such a hateful xenophobe particularly over Marco Rubio and Carly Fiorina”

          Thus Trump was rivaled only by the subhuman, Neanderthal Hillary Clinton and won only due to exclusionary principles.

          Trump could easily be beaten by a Republican like Rubio or Sasse but that would require they lose their souls to employ such visceral ugly tactics. I hope they never so

          There is no “coming around” for Trump. We are essentially a barbaric civilization with WiFi and cell phones, with a truly toxic, dysfunctional political system. It would be best to unleash plagues, a couple of ice ages and rain down fire to rid the planet of humans….then start over 100 million years later….perhaps I understate

          1. Oh trust me little Marco has “soul to lose” nor does Sasse.

            Perhaps if America is bad, and I agree it is but if you really want a taste of worse, sample a “toxic barbaric civilization” such as Mayheeco, i suggest.

            As for apocalypse, well, maybe it’s coming no matter what we say or do, we will see

          2. Juana, dear…….I would bet big money on the fact that any news you read or heard about Trump re: other races was either taken out of context, heavily edited, or outright fabricated.
            I have made a hobby out of researching what he has said publicly, and have found him to be fair, but grossly misunderstood because of the purposefully destructive agenda of his opposition.
            If you have any curiosity at all, you will do your own serious research…….or you can continue to let liberals do your “thinking” for you.
            It’s your choice.

            1. “I have made a hobby out of researching what he has said publicly, and have found him to be fair”, you are one SAD human being, get a life.

              1. Yeah, research makes him a sad human being. If he were non-sad, he’d follow your example and content himself with snotty drive bys.

              2. YNOT…..well, ya got me. I am unaware that researching the truth is now sad.
                I have GOT to get a copy of your Definitions for Dems, so I can keep up.

                1. FTR not a dem tho liberal and are usually stuck with them. As for copy of Dem definitions not sure what your point is other than RWNJisms.

              3. “get a life.”

                YNOT, you choose to be ignorant and Anonymous chooses to read. Who has the better life, a drunk ignoarant ditch digger or an intelligent worker who knows what is happening around him.

                Don’t answer YNOT, we already know. You prefer the former.

          3. as an immigrant Latina

            I’m remembering that in a deposition once, Rosie O’Donnell was asked about an incident in which she said to another party, “As a lesbian, I…”. Her reply was that the incident was fiction. She had, never in her life said anything like “As a lesbian, pass the salt…”.

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