New Lawsuit Against Trump Could Backfire Over The Use of Labels Like “China Virus” and ‘Wuhan Flu”

A new lawsuit by the Chinese American Civil Rights Coalition has garnered national attention in the media where former President Donald Trump is being sued for his use of such terms as the “Chinese Virus,” “China Virus,” “Wuhan Flu,” and “Kung Flu.” What is most interesting about this lawsuit is how it is arguably meritless under both tort and constitutional law. However, there has been little pushback from a host of lawyers who have spent months calling for sanctions against Republican lawyers for filing lawsuits viewed legally or factually meritless. This lawsuit seems designed to amplify a public relations campaign without substantial legal support. The question is whether it states just enough to avoid sanctions and whether the Trump team wants to seek such sanctions under Rule 11.  Trump is being sued in his official and personal capacities.

I previously criticized some Trump lawyers like Rudy Giuliani for making unsupported claims in press conferences about electoral fraud and explored how he and others could be sued for defamation by companies like Dominion (which later did file such actions). After Trump campaign and Republican Party counsel filed an array of lawsuits challenging electoral results in 2020, a long list of legal experts called for disbarments and sanctions for filing frivolous actions. Some of those complaints are still pending.  However, these same lawyers are largely silent in the face of meritless actions from the left. There was no outcry or calls for sanctions, let alone disbarments.

The lengthy complaint is long on political rhetoric and short on legal support. It recounts every use of these terms by Trump as well as violence against Asian individuals. These attacks are horrific and many reasonable view the use of these terms as fueling such anger.

However, terms like the “Chinese virus” have been widely used by various experts and commentators, including in scientific journals. Indeed, two Chinese experts referred to this as the “Wuhan virus” until they were pressured to take down their column.

While it is widely viewed as racially insensitive and inflammatory, the use is also heavily imbued with political meaning. Many, including members of Congress continue to use this term because of its origins. Moreover, many object that China has lied about the origins of the virus and arrested scientists who tried to tell the world about its dangers. It is political speech. (I have not used the term and instead to “COVID-19” OR “coronavirus” but it is chilling to see a public university encouraging students to stop others from referring to the “Chinese” or “Wuhan” virus.) This remains a point of political debate.

This is not about the merits of such labels but the legal basis to seek damages for their use. There is no legal basis in my view, though other may differ in that assessment.

The use of such labels is common in science and politics. People still refer to the “London variant” and “South Africa variant” of Covid. Other virus and diseases have been associated with areas where they originated like Zika, or Ebola. While the “Spanish flu” may not have started in Spain, it is still the common label for that epidemic.  Indeed, it was the term used by many scientists in the early stages and even liberals. HBO’s “Real Time with Bill Maher noted correctly “Scientists, who are generally pretty liberal, have been naming diseases after the places they came from for a very long time.”

Chinese American Civil Rights Coalition is demanding $22.9 million, or $1 for every Asian American and Pacific Islander living in the United States. (The relief section states that “Plaintiff will donate the award (a & b) to establish a museum that will showcase the history of Asian American and Pacific Islanders communities and their contribution to the United States of America.”). The damage demand reflects the symbolic character of the complaint.  However, lawyers are not supposed to use courts for political or symbolic statements.

Rule 11 states in part:

(b) Representations to the Court. By presenting to the court a pleading, written motion, or other paper—whether by signing, filing, submitting, or later advocating it—an attorney or unrepresented party certifies that to the best of the person’s knowledge, information, and belief, formed after an inquiry reasonable under the circumstances:

(1) it is not being presented for any improper purpose, such as to harass, cause unnecessary delay, or needlessly increase the cost of litigation;

(2) the claims, defenses, and other legal contentions are warranted by existing law or by a non-frivolous argument for extending, modifying, or reversing existing law or for establishing new law;

(3) the factual contentions have evidentiary support or, if specifically so identified, will likely have evidentiary support after a reasonable opportunity for further investigation or discovery; and

(4) the denials of factual contentions are warranted on the evidence or, if specifically so identified, are reasonably based on belief or a lack of information.

While a claim could be raised under the first category, it is the second category that would seem relevant to this complaint.  Three major problems stand out in the complaint.

Is this Defamation or Related Tortious Conduct?

First and foremost, the use of such terms is not in my view defamatory or a cognizable basis for a claim of intentional or negligent emotional distress.  This is an opinion. While the complaint briefly notes that some might claim opinion, it insists:

Labeling a statement an opinion does not automatically make it an opinion or make it safe from the possibility of it being defamatory. If a reader or listener could reasonably understand that the communication as stating a fact that could be verified, the communication will not be considered an opinion, especially if it is sufficiently derogatory to hurt the subject’s reputation. Also, a communication that is presented in the form of an opinion may be considered defamatory if it implies that the opinion is based on defamatory facts that have not been disclosed.

The first outbreak of Covid was traced to Wuhan, China and there continue to be allegations that it may have escaped from a virology lab in that city. As a locational reference, there is support for the term. The best argument against the use of the term is that it is inflammatory, not that there is no connection to China or Wuhan.  Trump could argue truth as a defense and fall back on opinion is needed in any litigation.

This is a classic example where opinion is protected under tort and constitutional law. It is also a statement from a public official or public figure.

Generally, parties must show (1) a defamatory statement of fact concerning the plaintiff; (2) publication to a third party; (3) fault [or in some cases actual malice for public officials or figures]; (4) falsity of the defamatory statement; and (5) special damages or per se accountability (defamatory on its face). See e.g.,  Biro v. Conde Nast, 883 F. Supp. 2d 441, 446 (S.D.N.Y. 2012).

The standard for defamation for public figures and officials in the United States is the product of a decision decades ago in New York Times v. Sullivan. Ironically, this is precisely the environment in which the opinion was written and he is precisely the type of plaintiff that the opinion was meant to deter. The Supreme Court ruled that tort law could not be used to overcome First Amendment protections for free speech or the free press. The Court sought to create “breathing space” for the media by articulating that standard that now applies to both public officials and public figures. In order to prevail, West must show either actual knowledge of its falsity or a reckless disregard of the truth.

Trump has prevailed in past defamation cases. As we discussed previously, Trump was sued by political strategist and TV pundit Cheryl Jacobus after Trump slammed her during the campaign.  She triggered the ire of Trump by going on television to criticize Trump as a “bad debater” who “comes off like a third grader faking his way through an oral report on current affairs.” Trump fired back on Twitter and said that Jacobus “begged us for a job. We said no and she went hostile. A real dummy!” Another tweet said Jacobus “begged my people for a job. Turned her down twice and she went hostile. Major loser, zero credibility!” Jacobus insisted that she was asked to apply and withdrew over her disagreement with Trump’s then-campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski. The court ruled that such tweets are manifestly opinion and not facts for the purposes of defamation law.

“Trump’s characterization of plaintiff as having ‘begged’ for a job is reasonably viewed as a loose, figurative, and hyperbolic reference to plaintiff’s state of mind and is therefore, not susceptible of objective verification . . . To the extent that the word ‘begged’ can be proven to be a false representation of plaintiff’s interest in the position, the defensive tone of the tweet, having followed plaintiff’s negative commentary about Trump, signals to readers that plaintiff and Trump were engaged in a petty quarrel.”

Courts have repeatedly stressed that parties should not try to litigate such differences of opinion in courts. In Ollman v. Evans 750 F.2d 970 (D.C. Cir. 1984), Novak and Evans wrote a scathing opinion piece that labeled a professor a Marxist who used his classroom for revolutionary purposes. The column goes on to take apart Ollman’s past writings, including what Ollman stated were clear misrepresentations. The court acknowledges that “the most troublesome statement in the column . . . [is] an anonymous political science professor is quoted as saying: ‘Ollman has no status within the profession but is a pure and simple activist.’”  Nevertheless, Judge Kenneth Starr wrote for the D.C. Circuit in finding no basis for defamation. This passage would seem relevant for secondary posters and activists using the article to criticize the family:

The reasonable reader who peruses an Evans and Novak column on the editorial or Op-Ed page is fully aware that the statements found there are not “hard” news like those printed on the front page or elsewhere in the news sections of the newspaper. Readers expect that columnists will make strong statements, sometimes phrased in a polemical manner that would hardly be considered balanced or fair elsewhere in the newspaper. National Rifle Association v. Dayton Newspaper, Inc., supra, 555 F.Supp. at 1309. That proposition is inherent in the very notion of an “Op-Ed page.” Because of obvious space limitations, it is also manifest that columnists or commentators will express themselves in condensed fashion without providing what might be considered the full picture. Columnists are, after all, writing a column, not a full-length scholarly article or a book. This broad understanding of the traditional function of a column like Evans and Novak will therefore predispose the average reader to regard what is found there to be opinion.

A reader of this particular Evans and Novak column would also have been influenced by the column’s express purpose. The columnists laid squarely before the reader their interest in ending what they deemed a “frivolous” debate among politicians over whether Mr. Ollman’s political beliefs should bar him from becoming head of the Department of Government and Politics at the University of Maryland. Instead, the authors plainly intimated in the column’s lead paragraph that they wanted to spark a more appropriate debate within academia over whether Mr. Ollman’s purpose in teaching was to indoctrinate his students. Later in the column, they openly questioned the measure or method of Professor Ollman’s scholarship. Evans and Novak made it clear that they were not purporting to set forth definitive conclusions, but instead meant to ventilate what in their view constituted the central questions raised by Mr. Ollman’s prospective appointment.

The association also raises collateral claims like emotional distress. However, those claims run directly counter to Supreme Court cases. One such case is Snyder v. Phelps, 562 U.S. 443 (2011). I previously wrote that such lawsuits are a direct threat to free speech, though I had serious problems with the awarding of costs to the church in a prior column.  I was therefore gladdened by the Supreme Court ruling 8-1 in favor of the free speech in the case, even if it meant a victory for odious Westboro Church. Roberts held that the distasteful message cannot influence the message:

“Speech is powerful. It can stir people to action, move them to tears of both joy and sorrow, and — as it did here — inflict great pain. On the facts before us, we cannot react to that pain by punishing the speaker.” Roberts further noted that “Westboro believes that America is morally flawed; many Americans might feel the same about Westboro. Westboro’s funeral picketing is certainly hurtful and its contribution to public discourse may be negligible. As a nation we have chosen a different course — to protect even hurtful speech on public issues to ensure that we do not stifle public debate.”

The Court in cases like New York Times v. Sullivan have long limited tort law where it would undermine the first amendment:” Given that Westboro’s speech was at a public place on a matter of public concern, that speech is entitled to “special protection” under the First Amendment.” Ironically, the Lincoln Project could ultimately echo the position of the lone dissenter: Justice Alito. The dissent  gave little credence to concerns over the constitutional rights raised in the case. He insisted that “[i]n order to have a society in which public issues can be openly and vigorously debated, it is not necessary to allow the brutalization of innocent victims like petitioner.”

Ironically, even the media recently has been seeking to broaden their own protections for what constitutes opinion in the characterization of actions as in the recent Veritas litigation.

This is not a close question in my view. There is no basis for this action based on the use of such common terms.

Group Libel

The complaint is filed on behalf of the organization but reads like a group libel action for every Asian American.  They are seeking damages on behalf of every Asian American.

Such lawsuits are very difficult to maintain.  In Neiman-Marcus v. Lait (1952), a New York federal district court addressed a defamation claim arising from the publication of the book “U.S.A. Confidential.” The author wrote that “some” models and “all” saleswomen at the Neiman-Marcus department store in Dallas were “call girls.” It also claimed that “most” of the salesmen in the men’s store were “faggots.” The store had nine models, 382 saleswomen and 25 salesmen. The court found the size of the group of women was too big to satisfy a group libel standard. However, the size of the group of salesmen was viewed as sufficiently small to go to trial.  This was one of the very view successful cases and it was only partially successful (decades ago).

A claim of defamation of every Asian American (the majority of whom are not Chinese) would seem ripe for dismissal under these cases.


A third problem is the nexus of the injury from these statements to the injuries experienced by all Asian Americans. Putting aside the claim that this organization should be able to claim the right to argue for all Asian Americans, it suggests that not only were all of these millions of citizens injured in the same way but that the injury is directly tied to Trump. These terms are ubiquitous and used by an array of public figures and commentators.

There are other problems in this complaint, but it is difficult to see the complaint surviving a motion to dismiss on any of these grounds alone. The question is whether President Trump will seek Rule 11 sanctions. Much like the insurrection lawsuits by figures like Rep. Eric Swalwell and Rep. Maxine Waters, this lawsuit could afford Trump an opportunity not only to highlight allegedly frivolous legal claims made against him but to get a ruling on his use of these controversial terms.  He might even seek to get a court opinion that the use of the term could be supported under a truth defense as the presumed origin of the virus.  For Asian Americans, such a ruling would undermine their continuing campaign against the use of these terms.

In my view, this lawsuit was not just politically ill-advised but legally unfounded. Some would likely differ in that assessment based on different readings of this precedent.  The issue is whether the cases are so clear that no reasonable lawyer would file such an action. That is a high standard and itself can be fraught with subjectivity.  The Chinese American Civil Rights Coalition could claim that these standards are not cut and dry on what constitutes opinion so it had a good-faith basis for the filing. While I do not see any chance of prevailing in the lawsuit, some judges could conclude that, while weak, these claims satisfy the minimum showing necessary under Rule 11. A court could also avoid the sensitive political elements by dismissing the case while rejecting sanctions. Nevertheless, Trump was given the advantage and can file a good-faith motion under Rule 11.

362 thoughts on “New Lawsuit Against Trump Could Backfire Over The Use of Labels Like “China Virus” and ‘Wuhan Flu””

  1. Ben Marcus comments that Israelis should have been given Nevada as a homeland and adds, “think of how good the Chinese food would be in Vegas.”

    Ok. I’ll bite. Does this remark have something to do with Christmas?

    For the record, I prefer Dim Sum.

  2. “So John, what you are saying is if a plurality of voters in Texas don’t like the results in Pennsylvania, there should be an inquiry by the courts.”

    Nope. I am saying that ALL elections have to be conducted such that nearly all of us can beleive and accept the results regardless of who wins.

    We spent 4 years with left wing nut nonsense that the Russians had elected Trump.

    That was a ludicrously stupid claim from the start.
    At its strongest – the claim was that someone Russians had persuaded legitimate voters to vote for Trump by the hundreds of thousands.

    While false – even if true that would not have been a lawless of fraudulent election.

    The RNC is free to influence voters, the DNC is free to influence voters, Jeff Bezos is, John Oliver is, Russia is.

    There is only one organization in existance that is NOT free to have a voice in US elections – and that is our government itself.

    What no one is free to do is coerce or induce votes.
    That is the reason that 28 states REQUIRE secret ballots – that is a ballot cast privately and secretly at a polling place where election officials assure that it is not possible to prove how any individual voter voted.

    Prior to the 20th century (and those state constitutional amendments) it was common place for employers to pay or coerce voters, for political parties to do so. In fact election spending dropped dramatically after those laws were enacted – because while you could pay someone to vote for your candidate – you could no longer verify that they did.

    Regardless a secret ballot requires that no one can ever be able to see a record of how a specific person voted – before or after their vote is cast.

    Prior to 2020 a handful of states did not have secret ballots.

    In 2020 nearly all states – including the 28 that had constitutional requirements for secret ballots – violated those requirements.

    That is Lawlessness.

    Worse that is a corrupt act on the part of govenrment.

    As I noted the one group that CAN NOT attempt to influence our elections is our own government.

    And yet that is exactly what they did.

    “Can you cite the law on that.”

    PA constitution A5S4 – as well as other provisions.

    The TX – and other states lawsuit in the supreme court – which has original jurisdiction for lawsuits between states,
    Correctly asserted that 6 states had failed to follow their own election laws.

    The constitution is fundimentally a contract between the states.
    A prerequisite for the existance of a federal government is the assumption that states will follow their own laws – particularly regarding federal elections.

    “Clearly there is no logical resaon for it,”
    Yet, clearly there is.

    In fact there are a great deal of logical reasons.
    There are numerous allegations of fraud made regarding this election.

    Many, might fail under actual scrutiny. But absent scrutiny – we are ALL deprived of our constitutional rights.

    There are allegations that photocopied ballots were counted. Can you prove that was not true ?

    We are talking about an election – the burden of proof that election results are trustworthy rests with the government.

    This is not about the dissatisfaction of candidates or parties with the outcome.

    Our courts have an absolute duty to assure that the law and constitution is followed – particularly in elections.
    Without lawful elections – the govenrment does not have the consent of the governed – the government is illegitimate.

    The left and democrats rant about Jan 6..

    Yet, absent trustworthy election – armed trump supporters could have marched on Washington, occupied the capital and demanded a trustworthy election. Read the declaration of independence. Violent resistance to government CAN be justified,

    It is the duty of the courts to assure that conditions justifying violent resistance to government never occur.
    In 2020 they failed.

    I noted the possibility of photocopied ballots. That is a trivial means of committing election fraud.
    It is also a detectable form of fraud.
    In fact every single alleged form of fraud is either detectable or preventable.
    Yet in 2020 specifically – and many prior elections more generally – little is done to prevent or address most forms of fraud.

    Ballot stuffing is only possible by election officials – when elections are conducted in person – as secret ballots require.

    But with mailin elections and hundreds of unattended ballot boxes ballot stuffing is trivial and anyone can conduct it.

    Trillions of dollars are at stake in US elections – are you going to say that would not induce anyone to commit fraud ?

    You made the russians the boogey monster fo the past 4 years – is it outside of Russias ability to stuff ballots in mailin elections ?

    Given that it is within my personal abilities to inject hundreds of thousands of ballots into elections conducted as the 2020 election was, why should I beleiver that no other nation, organization or individual would be able to do so ?

    With in person elections the two primary fraud threats are individuals voting multiple times under different names.
    Voter ID makes that impossible. Even without ID requirements it is sufficiently difficult that in person fraud can only effect very close elections – yet really close elections have become commonplace.

    The other means of fraud in in person elections is ballot stuffing by election officials.
    That occurs – several people from Philadelphia were convicted of doing so prior to the 2020 election.

    Fraud by election officials is more difficult to catch and/or prevent – but it is not impossible.

    Regardless it is much harder to commit when election laws are followed.

    One of the primary means of thwarting ballot injection is the use of election observers – again something that was common place in prior elections. But in 2020 in numerous places – all those where there is controversy election observers were prevented from doing their jobs.

    But beyond the legal requirements of state constitions and state election laws,

    There is a more fundimental requirement that was breached.

    The declaration of independences requirement that legitimate government MUST secure the consent of the governed.

    That is an extra constitutional, extra legal requirement.

    Those who brought down east germany and the USSR – did so in violation of their laws and constitutions.

    But we celebrate them as heros. Because the requirement that government secure the consent of the governed supercedes law and constitution.

    The purpose of all election laws is NOT “fairness” – it is to ensure that the results reflect the consent of the governed.

    We deride the banana republic elections of other nations – specifically because no matter what the count is, if it does not reflect the consent of the voters – the govenrment is not legitimate.

    Our laws – including election laws do not serve themselves. They are not their for the benefit of government.
    They exist to protect the rights of the people.

    I am not entitled to have my candidate win the election – if I was Jo Jo Johnson and Gary Johnson would have been president.

    I am entitled to an election where only the legitimate votes of legitimate voters are counted.

    Preventing election fraud is not that difficult. The most important tool is assuring that any fraud will be detected.
    That is the purpose of voter ID, of election observers of post election audits.

    A version of what is occuring in AZ should occur in every state shortly after every election.

    GA did conduct a random audit of 5000 mailin ballots in Cobb county.

    The results of that audit – undermine the GA elections.

    Of 5000 ballots 300 failed the state laws minimal signature match requirement and 30 were clearly fraudulent.

    That means of ballots audited 6% were invalid and 0.6% were fraudulent.
    This result should have triggered a broader random audit throughout GA.

    But it did not – those like you yawned. Raffensburger refused to order the required larger audit.

    The only evidence we have of the rates of illegimate and fraudulent votes in GA are both more than sufficient to change the election results.

    While that evidence is limited – it is real, and there is no counter evidence.

    Random audits should be part of every election.

    In NH we found a non-fraudulent error of consequence that has effected elections in NH for decades – as a result of an audit required by a democratic challenger.

    Trustworthy Elections REQUIRE all the things that the left and democrats are fighting – not this time, but EVERY time.

  3. One of many ongoing court cases (by a democratic judge) that is actually looking at the evidence.

    Which of those court decisions that you refered to looked at an actual ballot ?

    Which court states that upon examination no photocopied ballots were found ?
    No stacks of identical ballots were found ?
    No Pristine unfolded ballots were found ?

    Which court had an evidentiary hearing ?

    You fail to grasp – the courts failed they undermined trust in elections.

    If you go to the police and say you have been robbed, bringing affadavits from witnesses – the police are obligated to investigate.

    When they do not – government has failed.

    When the police declare a reported crime unfounded without conducting any investigation, they government fails

  4. The only one wrong is you

    You are correct as to fillings
    You are incorrect as to ruling or even being able to on the merits

    Any language in any judicial opinion referring to merits without evidentiary hearings is error

    Nor does any sane person actually believe that judges looked at affidavits etc
    Because a large number of those presented can not be evaded
    If a witness files an afadavit that they observed ballots being counted multiple times until an evidentiary hearing where that witness is cross examined that affidavit is legally presumed to be true
    A judge is not permitted to inquire beyond its 4 corners and obligated to accept it until an adversarial hearing on the evidence

    All you are doing is demonstrating the error of the courts

  5. No court has made any ruling consistent with the claim that Trump is a chronic and habitual liar.

    1. Anyone with common sense knows Trump is a liar.

      He tried to persuade his followers that the “Grab them by the pussy” tape was a fake.

      If you believe in Trump you are a sap.

      1. BM:

        “Anyone with common sense knows Trump is a liar.”
        Hey you didn’t drop any celebrity names in this one. Still, I’m betting you’re hooking up your hookah with Jennifer Garner about now! Or grabbing lunch with Janeane Garofalo! Or maybe just cavorting with Neil Cavuto!

        1. I had coffee with AC this morning and that was nice.

          I’m hoping Keanu Reeves ride up on his ‘cycle because I want to pitch him Nidever.

          He’d be perfect.

          I know a couple of people he knows from Point Break and I’ve heard he’s a decent guy, so we shall see.

          Seinfeld was here last week, talking about a big boat he had bought and Haulover Inlet and other things.

            1. It will be if Keanu Reeves rocks up and reads Nidever.

              Who can resist a western set in Santa Barbara in 1850, when the Gold Rush is on and the Mexicans are feeling left out and everyone is killing the Chumash and California is about to become a state.

              I’m thinking Scott Caan for Captain Stevenson and Matthew McConaughey for Too Tall.

              There’s a great scene (written by moui) where Captain Stevenson reads the riot act to Comandante de la Guerra about how Spain and Mexico poked around in Alta California for 300 years looking for gold – and missed it by three months.

          1. lying is an interesting word…every honest person I know has lied…but lying under oath is different…Marcus Bill Clinton was the best liar under oath I have seen in my lifetime…he proved before the senate and therefore before the world that only sex to procreate is sex…everything else is not sex and therefore legal…therefore Marcus explain to me how do you explain that to every person entering puberty including your kids…that means all sex is legal at any age…correct!!! if the female does not get pregnant…correct!!!…don’t we protect minors and lockup perverts but not Bill…he is above the law…correct!!!…now you know my disdain for lawyers…nobody lies better and gets their clients to lie too…it’s a very sick and evil world…led by a bunch of very rich liars!!!

            1. Yeah Clinton was a rascal who screwed up the presidency and also put two extremely damaging presidents in office.

              Clinton might not have had “sex with that woman” but he sure screwed Al Gore out of the presidency.

              Without the Lewinsky scandal I don’t think it would have been as close – hanging chads and all that.

              So we got Bush43, and 9/11 and wars in the Middle East and the Great Recession – which wasn’t so great.

              Thanks, Bill.

              And it was Hillbilly Bill backlash that was part of the antipathy against Hillary – the world was just tired of the Clinton dog and pony show, so America elected Trump.

              And so we got Trump – a charlatan and a conman in a time when America needed competent, intelligent leadership.

              Trump couldn’t con his way out of a pandemic, and America paid – dearly.

              I met Bill Clinton when he came walking down E Dock with Pierce Brosnan in Hawaii a few years ago.

              He was surprisingly frail.

              1. Clinton’s sexcapades probably tanked gore
                But his successes were the only reason gore had a shot

                Brash was a poor president
                Gore would have been worse

                Clinton was mixed
                Better than either bush or Obama
                But not Reagan
                Jury is still out on whether he was better than trump

                1. Better than Trump?

                  Every president was better than Trump.

                  Trump was a 1005 failure who capped it off by inciting a riot on the Capitol.

                  What is Trump’s legacy?

                  What accomplishments did he leave behind?

                  Trump is popular with the tired and the poor and the lost who are as dumb and vulgar as he is.

                  He was voted out by Americans who don’t want to see America become a Third World kleptocracy, run by Banana Republicans.

                  Obama was the best president of the last 40 years – by far.

                  1. “What accomplishments did he leave behind?”

                    Here are seven in no particular order. The economic recovery need not be mentioned because Biden presently survives on Trump’s economic policy.

                    The Abraham accords
                    The peace deal in Afghanistan
                    The destruction of ISIS territory and reduction of terrorism
                    Trade agreements
                    The wall
                    The vaccine
                    Space Force

                    Now as usual Marcus, I will ask you for Trump’s big significant lies as President with proof.

                    You do nothing but talk like a braggart and have despicable behavior whether it be under Ben Marcus or another alias.

                  2. “Better than Trump?
                    Every president was better than Trump.”

                    False. based on actual accomplishments and supporting data, Trump was the best president in the 21st century.
                    That is unfortunately not a very high standard.
                    But Bush did not manage it, nor did Obama, and Biden has fallen far short so far.

                    “Trump was a 1005 failure who capped it off by inciting a riot on the Capitol.”

                    There was no riot at the capital. There was legitimate pushback against a lawless election.
                    Please read the declaration of independence. The Section listing the lawless actions of King George and his agents was NOT meant as a howto guide for democrats.

                    “Obama was the best president of the last 40 years – by far.”

                    Obama was a lawless failure.
                    He could not even manage the abysmal 2% growth of the bush years – despite starting in the valley of a recession with nowhere to go but up. He is the first known president in US history to conspire to take down his successor.

                    Do you grasp that Trump’s economy was better than Obama’s even AFTER the damage of the pandemic ?

                    We had 4 years of declining world conflicts. We see them rising again.

                    We had the first president since Carter to NOT start a foreign conflict during their presidency.

                    We had significant deregulation – and contra the left – no one died, the world did not end – in fact it got better.

                    We had meaningful immigration law enforcement.

                    We did not have domestic tranquility – but that was because idiots like you rioted all the time.

                    You rant about Jan 6. – had Trump supporters actually behaved like democrats – Biden would not be president.
                    If that is your idea of a riot – then for the past year the left has been engaged in a civil war.

              2. Despite being handed a vaccine
                The pandemic is still ongoing

                Worse during Biden we are told everything the media and left told us that as a lie

                Masks are ineffective
                As is indoor social distancing

                What has Biden done that has worked ?

                We are seeing slowly declining deaths
                Mostly because summer is comming
                Just as we saw last year
                We will not know if the vaccines are effective until late fall

                Biden remains as clueless as ever

                And apparently we do not need to sanction Russia anymore because democrats ?
                Apparently Russians can build pipelines but Americans can’t
                Leftist logic for you

                And we do not need sanctions on China
                Would not want to stop the flow of Chinese cash to the Biden’s

                We had peace in the Mid East
                Now we don’t
                We were leaving Afghanistan
                Now who knows
                We were prosecuting rioters and arsonists
                Now we are only prosecuting people invited into the capital

                And on and on

      2. “Anyone with common sense knows Trump is a liar.”
        That is not the criteria for proving someone is lying.

        “If you believe in Trump you are a sap.”

        I do not just beleive anyone.

        So far Trump has made you and the left and the media all look like fools.

        You keep saying – “Trump lies about X”,
        and then it turns out Trump is right.

        It has gotten so bad that whenever you, the media, the left say anyone is lying – it is best to presume that it is you, the left, or the media lying.

  6. German Measles
    Middle East Respiratory Syndrome
    Lyme (a town in Connecticut) Disease
    Ebola (a river in the Congo)
    Spanish Flu
    Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever

  7. HHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAA Marcus…argue with Candance Owens…Larry Elder…Thomas Sowell…and Marshall Faulk…dude you are way over your head…in very deep water…and can’t swim…will I through you a lifeline???…it’s like the line in Dirty Harry by Clint Eastwood…and my first name is Harry…PUNK!…how many rounds did I fire???…do you feel lucky today PUNK!!!…don’t bring words and books to a gun fight PUNK!!!…FREE SPEACH remember the first amendment PUNK!!!

        1. Exactly what I was thinking yesterday about Ben when I seen his comment like this one.

          One good thing about free speech he shows everyone his 1st inclination is to move to unethical behaviour.

          Last I recall most judges are not amused unethical behaviour, but who knows today with so much corruption throughout the govt.

  8. “Chinese American Civil Rights Coalition is demanding $22.9 million, or $1 for every Asian American and Pacific Islander living in the United States. (The relief section states that “Plaintiff will donate the award (a & b) to establish a museum that will showcase the history of Asian American and Pacific Islanders communities and their contribution to the United States of America.”). The damage demand reflects the symbolic character of the complaint. However, lawyers are not supposed to use courts for political or symbolic statements.”
    Okay let’s limit the lawyers fee to $1.00 per lawyer and see how altruistic and motivated these folks truly are. Wanna bet this case was not taken on a contingent fee basis? I had a colleague who challenged a defense-paid medical expert saying “Okay doc if you’re so certain of your opinion would you mind signing a $750,000 note payable (in glorious color on a 3’x5′ poster board so the jury could see it) to the plaintiff if you’re wrong about her within five years?” He declined.

    There’s something about losing money that compels true clarity of mind and separates the saints from the charlatans.

  9. Jonathan: The Chinese American Civil Rights Coalition may face a lot of legal obstacles in suing Trump for defamation but their complaint, for anyone who has bothered to read it, provides a comprehensive roadmap of how Trump, Republican politicians and the right-wing press weaponized Covid-19 to attack China–falsely claiming the coronavirus was developed in a Chinese bio-lab in Wuhan. You even promoted this conspiracy theory in columns last year. Trump’s anti-China rhetoric and false claims resulted in a wave of anti- Chinese and anti-Asian harassment and physical attacks, particularly from Trump supporters. Trump’s actions were designed for one purpose–to deflect public attention away from his criminal negligence in handling the pandemic. But facts are hard to refute. After over a year of investigation neither WHO nor any other scientific investigative group has found any evidence the coronavirus was deliberately developed in a Chinese bio-weapons lab. The scientific consensus is that the coronavirus originated from natural causes. And there is some question whether the virus even originated in Wuhan. It will probably be years before we know exactly where the coronavirus originated. But this has not stopped Trump supporting conspiracy theorists from continuing to falsely claim Covid-19 was developed by China and allowed to spread to the US in order to damage Trump’s chances for re-election. In your column you claim “many object that China has lied about the origins of the virus and arrested scientists who tried to tell the world about its dangers”. Who are the “many”? You don’t tell us. What are the “lies” China has told about the origins of the virus? You also don’t say. Who are the “scientists” the Chinese government has arrested? You are strangely silent. Again, no facts or evidence–just unsubstantiated allegations and anti-Chinese rhetoric. If truth is a defense against defamation you are not helping Trump’s cause.

    Even today there are former members of the Trump administration who want us to believe the 2020 election was “stolen” by the Democrats and Covid-19 was developed by Trump’s enemies. Michael Flynn, Trump’s former national security advisor, just came out and says that the coronavirus “is all meant to gain control of society, to be able to force decisions on society, instead of allowing ‘we the people’ to make decisions”. I just have one question for you, Trump and his supporters. When are you going to tell the American people the truth instead of continuing to peddle unfounded allegations?

      1. … William claims, presenting absolutely no evidence at all for his claim.


          A World Health Organization-led team investigating the origins of the Covid-19 pandemic visited the Wuhan Institute of Virology on Feb. 3.

          The disclosure of the number of researchers, the timing of their illnesses and their hospital visits come on the eve of a meeting of the World Health Organization’s decision-making body, which is expected to discuss the next phase of an investigation into Covid-19’s origins. …

          Another person described the intelligence as stronger. “The information that we had coming from the various sources was of exquisite quality. It was very precise. What it didn’t tell you was exactly why they got sick,” he said, referring to the researchers. …

          The Wuhan Institute hasn’t shared raw data, safety logs and lab records on its extensive work with coronaviruses in bats, which many consider the most likely source of the virus. …

          Continued at site.


          How the COVID lab leak theory went from panned to seriously considered

          New House GOP intelligence report lays out “overwhelming circumstantial evidence” virus leaked from Wuhan lab conducting U.S.-backed research into bat coronaviruses that has been linked to gain-of-function studies. …

          “The primary focus was being able to respond rapidly to biological threats as they appeared,” explained Dr. David Rakestraw, a top scientist who was coordinating the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory’s response to COVID-19.

          “We were focused on both the potential for natural occurrences, like the most recent COVID-19, but also on the potential for adversaries to use advances in biotechnology to create novel threats that we wouldn’t have vaccines for, we wouldn’t have therapeutics for, so how would we get to a solution, a medical response?” he added.

          You can watch the video here:

        3. There is no need for evidence. Res ipsa loquitur. It is presumed to be true. And since There is no evidence to the contrary, the matter is settled.

    1. The truth is China developed the virus in their Wuhan lab. Note the recent revelation that the earliest cases were in workers at the Wuhan lab and no intermediate hosts in the wild have been found.

      1. That is not proven – and probably never will be – but the probability of natural origens is below 1:13000000000 and the odds of coming from the WIV are now well above 90%.

    2. Dennis,

      You raise some interesting questions. Turley’s modus operandi is to stick to the law and refrain from delving into the court of public opinion. His commentary is deliberately anodyne so as to appear objective. He tries to keep well within his lane as a legal analyst. His restraint is commendable.

      I wish there were no such thing as the court of public opinion in which there are no rules of evidence. Those rules evolved over centuries of practice and reasoning as the best way to secure truth. If only all our political disputes could be subject to those time-tested rules. It’s ironic that we employ these rules to settle petty disputes among men, but the great debates which effect the lives of a nation are held in the court of public opinion where anything goes- lies not subject to perjury, ad hominems, red herrings, straw man arguments, whataboutisms, no cross-examination, no impartial jury, etc. And now thanks to Trumpism, even when a dispute is resolved in a court of law, Trump would have you believe it was rigged….

      1. “And now thanks to Trumpism, even when a dispute is resolved in a court of law”

        Some people like Jeff can’t seem to recognize the discrepancies in this past election. Low information voter or liar, sometimes it’s hard to tell. Here is just one discussed today.

        New Hampshire Auditors Find Problem: Scan Counted 28 Percent of Test Ballots for GOP Candidates

        Republicans in Windham, New Hampshire won all four seats in the legislative election on Nov. 3, but a Democrat candidate, Kristi St. Lauren, requested a recount, which was granted because she lost by just 24 votes.

        However, during a hand recount, it was revealed that she didn’t lose by 24 votes. Instead, the effort revealed that the GOP candidates had actually received 300 additional votes, while St. Laurent lost 99 votes.

      2. You were doing great until the last sentence, which is really stupid. No court Made any ruling inconsistent either claim that the election was rigged.

        1. William_JD says that I “was doing great until the last sentence….”

          Damn, so close but no cigar!

          I was not referring to the election. I was referring to the fact that if Giuliani, Gaetz or Trump himself is convicted, you know as well as I do that Trumpists will not accept the verdict regardless of the magnitude or quality of the evidence. Trumpists do not have faith in the criminal justice system. They will invent some conspiracy theory to dismiss the ruling even after all the appeals have been exhausted. I have said that I will accept a verdict either way; yet no Trumpist here has yet been willing to publicly commit to accept these verdicts come what may.

          1. Has any Democrat political leader or talking head on MSNBC or CNN “accepted” the results of the 2016 election yet — without screaming Russia Russia Russia??


            1. The DOJ is a bunch of left-wing thugs, and the trial judges in DCD are from the same mold. We know that Trump hasn’t committed any federal crimes, but state-law crimes are possible.

              The real problem for you if there is a conviction in New York is not that impartial citizens will cite a lack of evidence. It is that impartial citizens will point out that the conviction is the fruit of a poisonous tree because the investigation lacked probable cause. It is a plain case of political persecution a la Beria’s “Show me the man; I’ll show you the crime.”

              1. William says, “It is a plain case of political persecution a la Beria’s “Show me the man; I’ll show you the crime.”

                So, if Trump or the Trump organization is found guilty of a Federal crime or a State crime anywhere, it is by definition a political persecution.

                Trump, therefore, is beyond the reach of the rule of law because his prosecutors are no more to be trusted than the sexual predator and blood-thirsty killer Lavrentiy Beria.

                I got that right?

                Any other Trumpists share this opinion? Do you suppose Turley does?

                  1. Begin at the most significant ones involving his Presidency. Make sure you differentiate fact from opinion. Provide proof.

                  2. Anyway you wish
                    But actual crimes and actual evidence
                    Not interested in evidence free allegations

                1. Nope

                  No do I care much about the politics

                  I care about the rule of law not man

                  Allegations are not crime

                  Even starting an investigation requires a credible allegation
                  That means evidence

                  If you wis to investigate trump or anyone provide an actual crime and some evidence to support the allegation

                  If you do not have that then you are violatining someone’s rights and You are committing a crime

                2. No one is beyond the law

                  But the law is not a weapon against your enemies

                  If you do not have credible evidence of an allegation you may not investigate period
                  Or you are the criminal

              2. Even an investigation requires an actual crime as well as credible evidence it occurred and the person you are investigating commited a crime

                The legal standard is low
                But it is higher than anything provided so far

            2. Has any democrat accepted the fact that the whole collusion delusion nonsense was an IQ test and anyone saying Putin wanted Trump as president FAILED. To the extent that some of our intelligence community beleived that nonsense – they too are morons.

              We have had ample demonstration – through my lifetime of the incompetence and stupidity of the left.

              But never so great as in the past year.

              Totalitarianism is no better dressed up as scientism.

          2. Of course they wont.
            The left has besmirched the courts so badly – who would beleive them ?

            IF you want people to beleive – produce actual evidence – of ANYTHING you have claimed ?

            Where is the evidence of the collusion delusion ?
            Of the natural origens of covid ?
            Of the russian disinformation campaign that is Hunter Biden’s laptop ?

            No one expects to see evidence of anything from the left.

            You make things up and then expect everyone to be stupid enough to beleive them.

            Do you understand why even today most republicans think the election was stolen ?

            It is simple. Because the left, the media and democrats have proven consistently untrustworthy about anything.

            You say Trump is a liar – but most everytime you call trump a liar – the facts prove Trump right eventually.

            I am not a trump supporter – yet the record is damning.

            No one can be right that often by chance.

            If the media said the Sun will rise tomorow Many of us would wonder if they are lying.

        2. Autocorrect sucks.

          No court has made any ruling inconsistent with the claim that the election was rigged.

          1. No plaintiff has presented convincing evidence that the election was rigged.

            1. There were no hearings
              No one was allowed to present evidence

              We had lawless elections
              That the courts were complicit with before the election

              I would note very serious problems have been found in windjammer nh
              These. Do not appear to be fraud but they are still consequential
              They found a failure in all 4 machines that is likely in every new hamphire machines

              And possibly in other voting machines
              More than 60% of test ballots produced wrong talllies

              1. So you’re saying the Supreme Court which was loaded with Trump supporters was complicit in bringing down Trump?

                They knew it was BS, as did anyone else with any integrity and an IQ over 120.

                1. Marcus the SCOTUS knows the constitution and how we are a republic which means states have rights which SCOTUS does not want to step on…but if enough states chose to rebel and leave the union there is absolutely nothing SCOTUS can do…we now have a very active COS and I hope we succeed to secede…

                  1. It would be swellegant if California seceded and all the dumbass, Trumper California-haters moved to Idaho or Arizona or wherever they belong and are more comfortable and the population of California was reduced by about 10 million so we would have a nice 30 million or so enjoying that GDP of $3.3 trillion although I don’t know what effect a population drop like that would have on GDP could it stay the same? would California be as productive with 30 million as it is now with 40 million? that would be great because California could do its thing without fear of being tainted by idiot presidents like Trump voted on by American idiots who don’t know a charlatan and a fraud when they see one.

                    1. Your posts demonstrate the failures of leftism

                      California has enjoyed many benefits particularly natural ones

                      But in the past few decades leftism is destroying it

                      But the standards of leftists it is a failure

                      CA has by far the worst income inequality in the country.

                      It is a state of haves and have nots

                      About 25% of all federal aide to the poor goes to CA

                      It has massive homelessness
                      That has gotten worse with each step the left takes to address homelessness

                      If you get rid of CA Republicans
                      California will starve

                      CA is an object lesson in what not to do for all other states

                      But for its natural advantages no one would live there

                2. When a plurality of people believe there was enough fraud to alter an election
                  And the courts do I not inquire
                  They have failed

                  When an election is lawless
                  The courts failed

                    1. I try to use the word that most accurately fits.

                      Further – especially when discussing government I try to use the same words in the same way all the time.

                      Government is force. We do not wish to use force based on confusion about words.

          2. William says “No court has made any ruling inconsistent with the claim that the election was rigged.”

            No court has made any ruling inconsistent with the claim that Trump is a chronic and habitual liar.

  10. These people claim to represent every Chinese American but Trump had enormous support from that community. Chinese Americans know perhaps better than any group what it means to live under a totalitarian regime and they have consistently overperformed in a Capitalist economy. Their businesses thrive, their kids knock the scores out of the park (and are then punished for it but that’s another matter). They foresaw – as did anyone with a few brain cells to rub together – the current state of affairs where a totalitarian dictatorship is supplanting the rule of law, one EO at a time, under cover of Covid.. It was never about Trump vs. Biden. Biden’s record was solidly moderate. The problem is that Biden is compromised. They said, “Do what we tell you and you get to be President.” And he said ok. But he is dancing on the end of somebody else’s strings and because of that the entire country is fast going down that road that is paved with good intentions while genuinely patriotic American Democrats look on and say “It must be ok because our boy Joe is doing it.” If this group truly claims to represent Chinese Americans, then go ask every Chinese American their opinion. This is just one more effort to harass Trump into not running in 2024.

    1. If Biden really beat trump
      Why wouldnt the left want trump to run again ?
      If Biden is doing so well
      Why wouldnt the left want trump to run again

      1. No one should want Trump to run again because he’s a malignant narcissist and con artist who exacerbates divisions in the country.

  11. And now this important message from The Plagiarist In Chief, the Puppet of the Left, who purportedly “won” more votes that Obama or Hillary Clinton, even though Trump won a greater percentage of the votes of Blacks, Hispanics, and Jews than he did in his first term:

    1. Our country is a worldwide joke now and every major country’s leaders know Biden is the weakest leader the US has ever had and will easily push us around and wreck havoc in their own region. Just look at Israel as an example. Where is our support for Israel? All we do is sue a past President over words and a PEACEFUL march in DC. BLM, Antifa, Wokism, Critical race theory, run the country today. We don’t rank number 1 in any category today except debt! We have fallen farther and faster than any country that’s ever been a world leader IMO. Every country laughs at us, takes advantage of us, bullies us, and what do we do??? send them more money…or sell them more top secret stuff at a huge discount and then beg them to be our ally/friend…what a country…if I wasn’t living it, it would make a good Hollywood B or C movie.

        1. the question is who were the criminals?…were they plants by the radical left?…every rally for Trump was peaceful until the radical left caused the initial conflict and then Trump supporters put an end to the violence/attack. I just looked up this Ben Marcus dude…what a joke…a philosopher…seriously…the most famous philosophers argued and debated their whole careers…wrote books…and were lifelong friends…and realized in the end they knew nothing at all…every person at a certain age can call themselves a philosopher but they do not have a right to intimidate or brainwash their students…or anyone else for that matter…dictators do that…and it never ends well…it ends in gynecide…Ben Marcus needs to read… Mein Kampf…I read every page because I do not want to live under a dictator…Marcus is half Jewish and half Catholic…but has chosen the far left like Schumer/Pelosi…I would never allow my children to be brainwashed by him!

        2. DOJ Seizes $90,000, Charges Black Lives Matter Supporter Allegedly ‘Stormed Capitol,’ Sold Footage to News Outlets
          BY JACK PHILLIPS May 23, 2021 Updated: May 23, 2021 biggersmaller Print
          The Department of Justice (DOJ) seized $90,000 from a Utah man who sold footage of Ashli Babbitt being shot during the Jan. 6 Capitol breach, according to court filings filed by federal prosecutors.

          John Earle Sullivan, a political activist who reportedly attended Black Lives Matter protests last year and who allegedly agitated rioters inside the Capitol, was also charged with new weapons charges, according to the documents unsealed last week.

  12. Turley misses the point. The most fundamental problem with the suit is that the alleged speech does not defame anyone.

      1. Lawsuits are a two-edged sword. The defendant’s attorneys are entitled to depose any party to the lawsuit under oath. Certain individuals and donors to the Chinese-American Coalition may find the public release of their identity and motives quite embarrassing and in, some cases, defamatory. There may be counter suits. One key rule that one might consider is “never initiate a frivolous lawsuit against a party that has deep pockets” – and Trump certainly has that. Besides, the terms are apropos.

        1. Harass Trump’s sorry ass.

          Make his life miserable.

          The good and decent people of America had to endure his BS and blather for four years.

          This is payback.

          Bury him in lawsuits, the way he buried America in BS.

    1. And truth is Trump’s best defense. It did come from China. Even the mainstream doctors are starting to believe this and want to investigate

      1. He doesn’t need a defense. The plaintiffs haven’t even alleged a prima facie case.

      1. Not under the law. But that is not the point of such suits. The objective is publicity and to stir up opprobrium (hatred) for the defendant.

        1. If that is the case the suit must be dismissed and the plaintiffs sanctioned

          The law is not supposed to be a tool for political ends

      2. the question is do the words cause harm…IMO NO harm is done…these words are true…in the US words that harm a persons character and can be proved to be lies is libel and slander and would deserve some remedy by the court…most of the time this only applies to famous people…if someone called me names or my wife names I would take care of it myself…I would not need a lawyer or a court. But that’s the way it’s done 99% of the time.

  13. Operation Warp Speed

    Operation Warp Speed (OWS) was a public–private partnership initiated by President Donald J. Trump and the United States government to facilitate and accelerate the development, manufacturing, and distribution of COVID-19 vaccines, therapeutics, and diagnostics.[1][2] The first news report of Operation Warp Speed was on April 29, 2020,[3][4][5] and the program was officially announced on May 15, 2020.[1] It was headed by Moncef Slaoui from May 2020 to January 2021.

    – Wiki

    Ben Marcus is a liar and a fraud.

    1. You mean huffing Lysol and taking an anti-malarial didn’t work?

      Trump is a screwup, which is why he was voted out after one term.

      You really have to be a major f##up to lose the presidency after one term.

      What is Trump’s legacy? Hmmm?

      What will he be remembered for? The riot? The impeachments?

      Improving ObamaCare?

      The Obama administration loaned Tesla $465 million to upgrade Fremont and build the S.

      They paid that loan back five years early and that money has created tens of thousands of jobs and hundreds of billions in wealth.

      Did Trump attempt or achieve anything even close to that?

      No, he paraded around in a stupid red hat and attempted nothing and achieved nothing – other than to play the fiddle during Coronavirus as hundreds of thousands of Americans died and the American economy lost trillions and millions of Americans went on unemployment.

      And now Biden is going to continue that with the American Jobs Plan.

      That’s Making America Great Again.

      Trump is a screwup worshipped by the weak and the tired and the poor and the huddled masses – like George.

        1. One of my noms des plumes is Mason Thorpe.


          When I worked for a magazine we had a receptionist who was sexy and not too bright.

          We were talking one day and she said, “That guy is a Mason Thorpe!”

          I said, “What?”

          She said, “You know, like a misogynist?”

          I said, “Misanthrope?”

          She said, “Yeah, misanthrope, that’s what I said.”

          So I used the name Mason Thorpe for some things I write.

          And I’m not a misanthrope.

          I just dont ike dumb people. or dishonest politicians or dumb people who follow dishonest politicans.

            1. I’m smart and talented and prolific and live in Malibu and right now I’m eating lobster rolls with Mia from Morocco and Kiki from Perugia and Vicky from Indiana.

              And watching 60 minutes and fixing my proposal for an opera called Deus ex Machina.

              It’s not so bad, really.

              1. No Ben you are not smart

                If the rest is true
                Good for you

                Regardless by the standards you offered
                You should loath yourself

              2. Actually, I think that sounds weird. Now I understand why you said what you did. You dream of being part of the elite.

                1. Im surrounded by the elite and associate them because they like the books I write.

                  They tend to be smart people.

                  I like smart people.

                  I have to come on here to argue with know-nothing proles.

                  1. Marcus your arrogance and condescending elite verbiage make you a menace to society…go troll somewhere else…or go back to bed with Obamas and Clintons books.

              3. Benny:

                “I’m smart and talented and prolific and live in Malibu and right now I’m eating lobster rolls with Mia from Morocco and Kiki from Perugia and Vicky from Indiana.”

                You forgot: Trustworthy, Loyal, Helpful, Friendly, Courteous, Kind, Obedient, Cheerful, Thrifty, Brave, Clean, Reverent, Modest and Humble with the latter two on full display.

                Don’t we all love Cali!

                    1. No I shook hands with Anne Coulter at a party once.

                      Shame on me.

                      House belonged to the guy who wrote My Cousin Vinny.

                      I cut that hand off, because it shamed me.

                      AC the guy who was driving the white Bronco.

                      A nice guy.

                    2. hey Marcus…2015 crime stats…whites killed by blacks 81%…blacks killed by blacks 97%…maybe it’s a black problem…maybe those reparations will calm them down…hahaha…those damn stats again…it’s no better in 2021…BLM has made it much worse.

                    3. Darren, please ban Ben Marcus for life for being the malign, erroneous, fraudulent, uncivil, hysterical, incoherent, non-productive, counterproductive and vacuous troll that he is.

                    4. Ban Ben Marcus for life? Why? Do not ban Ben! Especially since he is *this close* to being red-pilled. haha.

                      Plus it’s amusing to watch him get so triggered after getting fact-bombed by John Say.

                      George, Don’t be like the lefty totalitarians who censor, ban and shut down opinions they don’t “like” or get ‘triggered by’…

                      As the other ‘anon’ said, scroll away George, avert your eyes, and carry on.

                      As Turley says: more speech, not banned speech.

                    1. I don’t know what “red pilled” means.

                      If that means “banned” just say “banned.”

                      You don’t have to speak dork.

                    2. Red pilled is typically a reference to the matrix
                      However it goes back at lest to Alice in wonderland

                    3. ‘Red pill refers to (becoming enlightened to) the truth behind a situation, especially a truth that is difficult to accept or exposes disillusions. Red pill refers to (becoming enlightened to) the truth about reality, especially a truth that is difficult to accept or exposes disillusions.’

                    4. ‘Red pill is the part of a trace program. It helps Morpheus localize Neo’s pod. Blue Pill makes him fall asleep. So lets assume its a sedative of sorts. Neo takes the red pill, wakes up in the pod, a machine sees that something in the pod is not right, and disengages the cord from his brain.’

                      Blue pill makes you fall asleep. Red pill wakes you up. (Not woke, awake)

                      You’ll know when it happens.

                      Watch for it. It’s coming.

                    5. Marcus why don’t you take the time to listen to Victor Davis Hanson’s podcast about Why Does The Left Hate Israel?…also a piece written by Jonah Goldberg about how Hamas started this war…not Israel…Marcus are you an anti-Semite?…George Soros is…the number one financial supporter of the left…Terrorist Sympathizer Geraldo Rivera Throws Tantrum When He Gets Hit with the Facts…and he, like you Marcus, is half Jewish…or, and finally, read Norman Podhoretz’s book Why Are Jews Liberals?…Marcus, your religion is liberalism, not Judaism…IMO

                    6. While I would encourage people to read VDH
                      You have to live under a rock to not know that hamas started this
                      Hamas sent rockets Int Israel
                      The first riots were in the al ana’s mosque and did not involve Jews
                      There has never been a Palestinian state
                      The last time the region was independent of foreign rule it was ruled by Jews

                      Yet Israel has offered the Palestinians there own state

                      What they want is the extermination of jews

                    7. I’m looking for Jimmy Carter’s quote about Israel. How his family has been farming peanuts in the same place in Georgia for over a century and if someone rocked up and claimed the land and put a fence in his yard, he wouldn’t take that too good.

                      In simple terms, that defines Israel’s behavior in Palestine.

                      They’re as wrong as they can be.

                    8. How does that define israel’s behavior in Palestine ?

                      There has been no time since the fall of Israel before Christ that the land has not been under the authority of some foreign power.

                      There was NEVER a palestinian state. But there was an Israeli state.

                      The British palistinian mandate was for a state with both Palestinians and Jews.

                      That state exists – Israel. Palestinians who did not leave to fight against israel are citizens int he israeli state, They vote, they have representatives and a voice in government.

                      For those who left Israel has been perfectly willing to given them sovereignity in Land that was and is part of Israel.
                      In return for one simple thing – recognition of the existance of the state of Israel.

                      In 2001 Al Queda flew airplanes into a few american buildings. In response the US invaded two countries and is STILL two decades later throwing our weight arround in one of those.

                      The West bank has sought to kill Jews for 75 years – the fact that Israel has not leveled the west bank shows incredible patience.

                      Within my lifetime there was significant jewish presence in much of the mideast. They have nearly all been killed or forced out.
                      Despite the fact that jewish presence in those regions predates islam. After driving Jews out the same states have been driving christians out. Again despite the fact that these are some of the oldest christian groups in the world and again predate islam.

                    9. Agree…all Israel has ever done in it’s entire existence is defend itself…Israel has never been the aggressor…my worry for my kids and grandkids is the growth of Islam since they can have as many wives and children as they want…it becomes a numbers game…sooner or later they take over…and then all women live under Sharia law all over the world…thankfully I will be gone by then.

                    10. “if someone rocked up and claimed the land and put a fence in his yard, he wouldn’t take that too good. In simple terms, that defines Israel’s behavior in Palestine. They’re as wrong as they can be.”

                      Ben Marcus is ignorant of history and almost anything else he talks about.

                      In 1876 a Jewish Trust bought the lands of Sheikh Jarrah for religious reasons. It was adjacent to an important religious 14th century tomb, Sheikh Jarrah. Jews had legal ownership and occupied the land until the 1948 war when Jordon illegally annexed the land and unlawfully replaced the Jewish occupants with Arabs. No title was provided to the Arab residents who paid rent to the Jordanian government.

                      In 1967 Israel recaptured the land. It was annexed, and according to the law, the land was returned to its original owners. Almost 40 years ago, the Jewish owners of the land wanted to evict the Arab families, but an agreement was made where the residents accepted Jewish ownership, and they could remain as tenants. . Moving forward, leases ended and, squatters started living there. More legal battles ensued. Those living there refused to pay rent. 4 tenants were evicted for not paying rent. This was part of the justification for Hamas to launch almost 5,000 rockets into civilian areas of Israel.

                    11. then let’s never ever give Israel support…no money…no military support…no intellectual property…and also we never take anything from them and also ALL Jews worldwide MUST go back and stay but they get to take everything they have given to the world back too…all art…all music…all books…all science…they take back everything and we just sit and watch the Muslims kill them all off…sure sounds like you support gynecide…are you a Hitler fan???

                    12. “are you a Hitler fan???”

                      Though you comment came in email addressed to S. Meyer, I assume your remark was to Ben Marcus.

                    13. Gynecide? That sounds kinda sicko-sexual.

                      No I don’t support Hitler although the support for Trump helps me understand how the Germans could have supported Hitler and Nazism out of ignorance, arrogance. fear, insecurity, greed, hatred, racism and self interest.

                      If you bulldoze houses people have lived in for generations, they’re gonna fight back.

                      Period. End of story.

                      Israel can’t keep expanding into places where others live.

                      We should just given them Nevada.

                      Nevada is 110,567 square miles.

                      Israel is 8,550 square miles.

                      God is everywhere, right?

                      Think of the trouble and strife and blood that would have been avoided.

                      And think of how good the Chinese food would be in Vegas.

                    14. “If you bulldoze houses people have lived in for generations, they’re gonna fight back.”

                      What do you think happened to all the Jews living in Arab controlled land or the Christians for that matter. The Jews were killed or told to leave under the threat of death. Their property and money was taken. Sheikh Jarrah lands were owned by Jews and illegally taken by Jordon.

                      Israel did not force anyone to leave.

                      Ben Marcus, your extreme bias is known as anti-Semitism no matter what religion you might carry with you.

                    15. Ha! Benjamin Michael Marcus? What does that sound like to you?

                      I’m a semisemite – my granny was a card-carrying, oi vey gevalting Jewish granny.

                      But wrong is wrong.

                      Expanding in the modern world is just gonna cause trouble and strife.

                      Shoulda given Nevada to the Jews.

                      Hell, just half of Nevada would be more than enough.

                      God is everywhere, right?

                      The Jewish families I know have as many or more kids than the Mormons or East Indians and that is a big big mistake in a world that is already hopelessly overpopulated.

                      So they have nine kids each, and they have to find room for them, so they expand and bulldoze people out of their homes.

                      People are going to fight back, simple as that.

                      And they aren’t going to quite.

                      If someone bulldozed you out of your house, you would do the same and you wouldn’t to arguments like this: “What do you think happened to all the Jews living in Arab controlled land or the Christians for that matter. The Jews were killed or told to leave under the threat of death. Their property and money was taken. Sheikh Jarrah lands were owned by Jews and illegally taken by Jordon.”

                    16. “People are going to fight back, simple as that.”

                      Jews have that right as well, but for the anti-Semite, kill the Jew is OK but a Jew defending himself is not. We all know what you are but we learn every day how little you know.

                    17. Are the Palestinians bulldozing Israeli homes and displacing them?

                      Or vice versa?

                      You try to displace people, they’re gonna fight back.

                      Jimmie Carter would. You would. Everyone would.

                      Simple as that.

                    18. “Are the Palestinians bulldozing Israeli homes and displacing them?”

                      Ben, be careful, because if you don’t know what is happening with all that has been written some might call you an idiot.

                      The Palestinians don’t want Israel to exist. Part of the Hamas charter is to destroy Israel. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem partnered with Hitlerr both wishing to exterminate the Jews. Several peace treaties were brought to the table where the Palestinians got 95%+ of what they were asking for. What they didn’t get was the extermination of the Jews and the destruction of Israel.

                      Why aren’t you calling for the Arab nations to give back the land and money taken from the Jews when they killed or made them leave their homes. The numbers of “Palestinians” and Jews displaced were about the same.

                      A person with such bias is an anti-Semite and a racist.

                    19. “Are the Palestinians bulldozing Israeli homes and displacing them?”
                      No, they are firing thouasands of rockets at jews trying to kill them.

                      The Israeli’s are not trying to drive the palestinians out of Gaza, or the West bank – nor are they driving the substantial paalestinian minority out of the rest of Israel.

                      If the Palestinians do not want Tanks in Gaza – that is trivial to accomplish – do not send rockets into Israel.

                      The dispute that started this was an eviction. It was not buldozing anything.

                      If you are a tenant and you quit paying rent, you should expect to be evicted.
                      That is what happened.

                      “You try to displace people, they’re gonna fight back.”
                      That is correct – but it is not what happened.

                      “Jimmie Carter would. You would. Everyone would.

                      Simple as that.”
                      Except that is not what happened.

                      As always left wingnuts misrepresenting the facts.

                    20. “The palestinians are also Semites.”

                      Absolutely. The physical structures are similar as well. I know many Israeli’s and Arabs (Palestinian and others) from the lands adjacent to Israel that are business partners in the US.

                      For the most part, the hate that exists is created by the Palestinian leadership that rules its people with guns to their heads. They force the education of the youth to hate Jews and to kill them. People like Jeff and Ben close their eyes to these atrocities while they spout their dogma.

                    21. From 1970 until 2005 there was very little growth in the Jewish population world wide.
                      Since 2005 the growth rate has been 0.78% – that is more than whites, but less than any other consequential ethinic groups.

                      Most Jews in the world today – live in either the US or Israel. They have been driven out of most of the rest of the world.

                      The total world Jewish population is STILL nower than it was before the hollocaust.

                      Nor BTW was the hollocaust all that unusual. There have been numerous times in the past 2 millenia in which more than a Million jews were killed at one time – at times when the world jewish population was far smaller.

                      Today theare are about 13.5M jews in the world – less than 0.2% of the population.

                    22. Ben is an idiot. He is completely unaware that in my lifetime nearly every nation in the mideast, and north africa had a larger percentage of jews than the US. These countries also had very large christian minorities.
                      Today there are very few jews anywhere in the mideast except Israel – not because the wanted to go to Israel – but because they were forced out (or murdered). The same is true of the christians. Though there are still a few of those left in some places.

                    23. John, the only thing I can say is to repost first four lines from the poem by Pope.

                      A little learning is a dangerous thing;
                      Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
                      There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
                      And drinking largely sobers us again. …

                      Ben hasn’t even gotten to line one. He has the mindset of a newborn baby placed in an adult world so all he can do is make up stories.

                    24. No I just live in a place loaded with wealthy, smart, accomplished, progressive people, where Trumpers aren’t comfortable and can’t afford to live anyway.

                      Californians are incredulous at how a good chunk of America thinks – how can they be that naive and misinformed and easily lead?

                      So we have to go online to mine the minds of proles.

                      It’s frightening.

                      Thank God for California – an island of sense in a country full of dopes.

                    25. “No I just live in a place loaded with wealthy, smart, accomplished, progressive people,”

                      That are FLEEING.

                      “Californians are incredulous at how a good chunk of America thinks – how can they be that naive and misinformed and easily lead?”

                      And the rest of us feel the same about CA.

                      CA is blessed by nature with incredible advantages – and yet you $hit in your own garden.

                      As you note – CA has a large amount of wealth – in fact the greatest wealth inequality in the country – yet you lecture the rest of us.

                      You have made one of the most beautiful parts of the country a He!!hole that people are fleeing.

                      Gang Violence, high crime rates, massive homelessness, people $hitting in the streets.

                      You took one of the best education systems in the country – and destroyed it.
                      You had one of the best public college systems in the world and you are destroying it.

                      The examples of stupid wasteful government incompetence of the left in California is a lesson for the rest of us.

                      Regardless, I do not wish to dwell on the problems of California – everyone can see them for themselves.

                      But clean your own house before you tell the rest of us how to live.

                    26. I have repeatedly compared the left at this moment to the Cultural Revolution in China.

                      That analogy is not perfect – and hopefully those imperfections will result in the failure of this US cultural revolution.
                      There is no Mao or CCP in the US today to protect the current violent anarchist children seeking to burn history and denounce adults.

                      But in most other ways what we see now mirrors the Chinese Cultural revolution.

                      Silencing of dissent. A revolution of poorly educated children intent on destroying actual history.
                      Even the fact that most victims of “cancel culture” are those on the left that are insufficiently dogmatic, mirrors the cultural revolution (and Stalinism in Russia).

                      The most dangerous “silencing” is not of those on the right – it is the effective supression of any dissent on the left.

                      Trump is not going to kowtow to the left. He is not going to beg forgiveness. Nor are the myriads of other conservatives the left silences.

                      But the professors on the left who say “wait a minute that is not supported by facts” who are silenced, near universally confess their sins, repent and rejoin the fold, and all on the left learn the important lesson – that deviation from the self contradictory dogma of the moment is intolerable.

                    27. The whole left/right thing is the opiate of the masses. It’s a way to control and distract drips who actually believe in all that stuff.

                      There’s a whole layer of Americans who hover above all that nonsense, are secretly glad they aren’t that gullible and dumb and who throw peanuts at all the equally stupid dopes in QAnon and BLM and Antifa and the Republican party.

                      You people are pointless little proles, arguing about nothing.

                    28. “The whole left/right thing is the opiate of the masses.”
                      Unfortunately not.

                      History provides ample evidence of the bloody horror of the let.

                      ” It’s a way to control and distract drips who actually believe in all that stuff.”

                      This is your idea of logic ?

                      1 + 1 = 2

                      Whether you beleive so or not.

                      Our survival – individually and as a group – depends on being right sufficiently.

                      Without sufficient knowledge of what we can safely eat – we play a game of russian roulette every time we forage for food.

                      The complex and presperous world we live in depends on being right about much nearly all the time.

                      Like it or not – some ideas work, some do not.

                    29. Ben, your remarks are so idiotic, one wonders if you are just another Titania McGrath.

                    30. I am surprised you would openly admit such ignorance.

                      Especially where there is a wikipedia page.


                      Tatania McGrath is a famous woke parody by comic Andrew Doyle.

                      “she” has several books published, and a huge twitter following. Many of whom do not grasp that she is a parody account.

                      The left has no sense of humor.

                    31. “No I don’t support Hitler although the support for Trump helps me understand how the Germans”

                      It is this nonsense that should embarrass you.

                      For 4 years more so that any president in my lifetime – Trump followed the LAW.

                      Can you cite an instance where Trump acted outside the law – with actual evidence – stupid lies pushed by the left and the press that fell apart are not examples of lawlessness – they are examples of the degree to which the left and the media are untrustworthy.

                      Obama set a record for the number of times SCOTUS ruled 9-0 against him.
                      Biden is already seeking to best that – and may already be ahead of Trump.

                      Nazi, Authoritarian, Totalitarian – these words have meaning – and they do not mean – follows the law.
                      The do not mean ends lawless policies that you like.
                      They do not mean “I do not like Trump”.

                    32. “If you bulldoze houses people have lived in for generations, they’re gonna fight back.

                      Period. End of story.”

                      And if you steal what belongs to others you can expect they will take it back.

                      BTW I would note that Obama tried to Drive the Bundies off of land they had ranched for 150 years.

                      “Israel can’t keep expanding into places where others live.”

                      Israel is NOT expanding. Like it or not the only role the government played in this was enforcing an eviction of tenants who failed to pay their rent.

                      “We should just given them Nevada.”
                      Nevada is not Israel.

                      Regardless the terrorists have perfectly good land they can occupy. They could even be recognized as a country.
                      But you can always count on the palestinians to blow any chance for peace. Any chance to actually get what they want.

                      When Clinton was on his way out both he and the Israeli’s were desparate for a deal.
                      The offered Arrafat everything he claimed he wanted – still no deal.

                      As always – you are a clueless lefty who is completely oblivious to actual history – both recent and past.

                      The only people oppressing those in the West Bank and Gaza are their own leaders.
                      So long as they are not so stupid as to try to kill people OUTSIDE the land they control – Israel leaves them alone.
                      They have one of the most corrupt governments in the world.
                      The poverty of their own people is their own fault.

                      “We should just given them Nevada.”
                      Would you make the same offer to the Palestinians ?
                      No sane person would – No on wants the Palestinians.
                      Not because they are oppressed, but because they are dangerous to themselves and anyone arround them.

                      By your logic – why don’t we solve the race problems in the US by sending blacks back to Africa ?

                      Or give them part of Nevada ?

                      The point is that the idea that shipping people elsewhere will solve problems is stupid, it has been tried. It does not work well.

                    33. There are 3 competing issues with respect to “islam”.

                      First the Gaza is little more than a large terror cell.
                      Islam is not a particularly relevant issue with respect to Gaza.
                      The west bank appears to be significantly less of a problem.

                      Independent of Israel – the majority of terrorism in the world today is connected with Islam.
                      This is not excusable, and it is a reason not to deal with these places.
                      One of the big deals about US fracking is disconnecting the US from nations that are deeply problematic.
                      One of the things that should have been self evident while Trump was president is there are no good actors in the mideast.
                      There is just bad and worse. But for oil we would be wise to leave the mideast alone.

                      The last issue is that Islam itself is possibly the most represssive religion that exists today.
                      It is virulently anti-women, anti-gay, anti-tolerance. It is extremely difficult to understand why the modern left which while rant endlessly about the religious right, is in bed with islam.

                      Because unfortunagtely today these things need to be said – none of the above means that there are not many decent muslims.
                      Few muslims are terrorists. But most terrorists are muslim. All of islam is not intolerant – but very little of it is tho the left of Jerry Falwell on the issues that the left cares about.

          1. ‘If there is such a thing as “systemic racism,” Press Sec, Jen Psaki is living proof. They took a privileged white woman who did zero for the campaign and elevated her above a more qualified black woman, Symone D.Sanders, who endured months on the trail and physically defended Biden.’ @joelpollak


              1. Simone got the position of spokesperson for the Giggler. So it’s just a matter of time before Simone moves into the top gig.

            1. One decision is not a system. Systemic racism is what whites re dealing with, where the most powerful institutions are racist against whites and use their power to force ever smaller institutions to do the same.

        2. Yet another dumbass comment by Ben Marcus. His ratings have little relevance to the story.

    1. Biden vaccine.

      Trump would have screwed it up and played politics and figured out how to make a minus.

      How about Silver Lining Virus because the silver lining in Covid is it swept Trump from office and we don’t have to listen to his flatulent blather any longer.

        1. Trump would have screwed up the vaccine rollout the way he screwed up everything else.

          He would have played politics with it and withheld it from places who know he’s an idiot – California being #1.

          Thank Odin that idiot is out of office and America has sane, responsible leadership again.

          Republicans screw it up. Democrats clean it up.

          True in California. True in America.

      1. “Biden vaccine.”

        Actually there was a Biden vaccine back during the Obama administration – it was late and likely cost thousands of lives.

        “Trump would have screwed it up and played politics and figured out how to make a minus.”

        We hear this garbage from lefties all the time – like the collusion delusion. Or that Hunter Biden’s emails are russian disinformation,
        or that the virus came from a wet market not a lab,

        or that masks and lockdowns work.
        Or that Biden won the election.
        Or that Biden is not demented.
        Or that anyone likes Harris.
        Or that Biden knows what he is saying.
        Or that black entrepeneurs can not get lawyers and accountants.
        Or that this summers riots were mostly peaceful

        or ….

  14. “A new lawsuit by the Chinese American Civil Rights Coalition has garnered national attention in the media where former President Donald Trump is being sued for his use of such terms as the “Chinese Virus,” “China Virus,” “Wuhan Flu,” and “Kung Flu.” ”

    Dat’s Way-cist

    Wuhan Chinese Virologist Doc, starts at 3:30 minutes in, it’s short, then media cover up talk. she’s on again about 8:00 minutes in, her interview last til 14:18.

    1. Hey Fauci, Bill Gates/Gates Foundation, Obama, etc., you boys seem to be caught in major crossfires…. Wuhan Flu, Ebola, HIV-AIDS, Deer Wasting Disease, Lyme Disease, etc.,…….

      North Carolina/Wuhan….UT etc….


      Rand Paul Exposes Dr Fauci’s War crimes In Senate Hearing


      May 12, 2021
      Most Banned Videos
      Most Banned Videos

      Senator Rand Paul lays out the case that Dr Fauci was funding and authorized gain of function research he knew was being shared with China.

      1. Copy, Retain for personal safety:

        Vaccine Refusal Text

        From Dr. Francis Boyle
        Notice – By authority of the Nuremberg Code
        On Medical Experimentation, I do hereby
        exercise my right to refuse to submit to or
        to Administer the Covid-19 vaccine.

        The United States Government has
        persecuted, convicted and executed Medical
        Doctors who have violated the Nuremberg
        Code on Medical Experimentation.

        Aiders and Abettors of Nuremberg Crimes are
        equally guilty and have also been persecuted,
        convicted and executed.

        Francis A. Boyle

    2. December 8, 2020 by Chief Visionary Officer & Founder
      International Attorney Dr. Francis Boyle: ‘Bioweapon’ mRNA COVID-19 Vaccines Violate Nuremberg Ruling Against Nazi Cruelty | Video
      Francis Boyle drafted the US domestic implementing legislation for the Biological Weapons Convention, known as the Biological Weapons Anti-Terrorism Act of 1989, that was approved unanimously by both Houses of the US Congress
      and signed into law by President George H.W. Bush.

      Dr. Francis Boyle joins The Alex Jones Show to expose how forcing the untested lethal mRNA COVID-19 vaccine on the public violates the Nuremburg Trials ruling against Nazi medical experimentation cruelty. Mandating such a vaccine is a “war crime”.

      “…mRNA vaccines intervene directly in the genetic material of the patient and therefore alter the individual genetic material, which represents the genetic manipulation, something that was already forbidden and considered criminal. This intervention can be compared to genetically manipulated food, which is also highly controversial”. ~ Robert F. Kennedy, Children’s Health Defense

      The mRNA COVID-19 vaccine about to be unleashed on an unsuspecting public is a bioweapon intended to damage human DNA permanently. This is another holocaust in the making. Do not be fooled by the marketing hype and the FDA safety studies (which never happened).

      Source: 79Days & InfoWars

  15. The lawsuit that should be happening is a multi-trillion dollar lawsuit against Communist China for recklessly exporting the most expensive virus ever created in a lab. Their lab. The Wuhan Institute of Virology. Nothing Communist China says or does should distract from this reality.

    1. Now that I agree with.

      As I have been saying all along, if Trump was the deal-making, China-hating badass he claimed to be, he would have – with the swipe of a pen – nullified the $1 trillion in American debt held by China – and divert those billions in interest payments to American families and companies who suffered from Coronavirus.

      And that $1 trillion would just be the start – a fraction of the damages and compensation owed America.

      And Trump could have encouraged all other Chinese-debtor nations to do the same.

      Because what do you think the total worldwide damages from Covid will add up to?

      Into the quadrillions?

      But what did Trump do?

      Cancel TikTok?

      That’s it?


      Paper tiger.

      1. Ben, so we cancel our debt to China and they cancel the 1.1 trillion of debt that China owes to the U.S. You just can’t wrap your brain around the idea that the road runs in both directions. Another bit of evidence of a position of “just spout it out” philosophy. It seems that you have conveniently forgotten the Trump tariffs on Chinese goods. When China paid the billions of dollars in tariffs I don’t think the idea of a paper tiger came to their minds. The more you post the more we know.

        1. The Chinese tariffs were a bust and did more harm than good.

          When Trump imposed a 10% tariff on $300 billion dollars worth of Chinese Goods China put a halt to the sale of ALL American agricultural products. So guess who that hurt?

          The tariffs were a bust.


          Because Trump is a f****** overseeing a team of f*** ups.

          Worshipped by f*** ups.

          1. Hey Ben, if the Trump China tariffs were a bust why has the Biden administration left them in place? You see, when you say that everything that Trump did was wrong and then we find out that his policies are being continued by the Biden administration your reputation as a biased source of knowledge is exponentially certified. Let me make a suggestion. Google it before you post to avoid embarrassment. The more you post the more we know.

            1. One step at a time. Biden is busy cleaning up the Covid mess and maybe doesn’t have time for China tariffs.

              They are costing America billions.

              Why did Trump leave Obamacare in place?

          2. Trump was right about the virus likely coming from the virology lab in Wuhan. And he was right about what the Covidi infection fatality rate would end up being.

            Trump was right about a lot of things.

            Fauci was wrong about a lot of things.

            But you will not hear about this in the propaganda press, of course.

            1. Oh you hear both sides in the propaganda news.

              Fox and Breitbart and OAN are up Trump’s bum and do his bidding.

              Trump wasn’t right about anything, which is why he was voted out by the same landslide that voted him in.

              1. Did fox or OAN ever claim to be the newspaper of record ?

                You think Trump said things that were wrong
                Biden is just a F#*k up

                I hope he gets his act together soon
                Before the country has to suffer more of Biden’s successes

                1. Biden has to mop up Trump’s mess before he can really lead, but the American Jobs Plan is a very good start.

                  That is MAGA.

                  Dragging America into the 21st Century.

                  You don’t get it, but you’re a nitwit so it don’t matter.

                  Biden wants to make America California again, and he’s right about that.

                  1. There have been nearly as many deaths in Biden’s 100 days as Trumps last year
                    8x as many Illegal drugs are crossing the border
                    2x as many people died of drug overdoses in sf as covid
                    There was no war between Palestinians and Israel during trump
                    China and Russia are more beligerant

                    The us economy was poised for a strong recovery and is now faltering
                    Inflation is rearing its ugly head food and gas and home prices are way up
                    Wages are not
                    People are not going back to work
                    The work economy is teetering
                    More illegals crossed in April than in 2020
                    And democrats are worried about losing a special election in NM ina district Biden purportedly won by 22pts

                    1. Yup. And the Chinese sit there laughing at us while they salivate. Take your pick of the words of their great warrior leader, Sun Tzu, re their success with Covid and stoking the fires of division in America:
                      “Supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy’s resistance without fighting.”
                      “The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting.”

                    2. China will be in for a great big surprise if they ever really piss off Uncle Sam.

                      I have seen the American military close up and came away with one impression: You piss off Uncle Sam and you’re gonna get your ass kicked.

                      China has how many aircraft carriers? One? Two?

                      Does China have planes that compare to B1s and B2s and Warthogs and Raptors and F35s and Hornets and about a dozen other planes?

                      Doubt it.

                      Chuck Fina. Paper tiger.

                      Same size as America but with 1.1 billion more people.

                      They’ve got their own problems, just feeding their people every day.

                    3. “There have been nearly as many deaths in Biden’s 100 days as Trumps last year”

                      You say that as if it implies something bad about Biden in comparison with Trump. It does not.

                      Deaths lag infections.
                      At the beginning of Trump’s last year, there was a single confirmed SARS-CoV-2 case in the US.
                      At the beginning of Biden’s term, there was a 7-day moving average of about 180,000 new cases per day that he inherited from Trump.
                      Of course there have been a lot of deaths during Biden’s term: because Trump f’ed up dealing with the pandemic and left Biden with lots of transmission and infected people. The economy faltered to such a great extent because of Trump’s inept response to the pandemic. Trump is more of a F#*k up than Biden.

                    4. Anonymous the Stupid, you must have failed logic, statistics and common sense. There are all different ways of looking at the numbers but the way you do it demonstrates one without any education what so ever.

                    5. ““There have been nearly as many deaths in Biden’s 100 days as Trumps last year”

                      You say that as if it implies something bad about Biden in comparison with Trump. It does not.”
                      Of course it does. I beleive there are now officially more C19 deaths in 2021 than in 2020, and 2021 is not even half over.

                      Biden promised that he could do much better than Trump – he has not.

                      “Deaths lag infections.”
                      By at most 14 days – not half a year.

                      “At the beginning of Biden’s term, there was a 7-day moving average of about 180,000 new cases per day that he inherited from Trump.”
                      Mathematics is not inheritable.

                      I will be happy to let Biden off the hook for not being able to control something that can not be controlled.
                      Except that Both you and Biden told me repeatedly all last year that was not the case.

                      “The economy faltered to such a great extent because of Trump’s inept response to the pandemic.”

                      No the economy faltered for the trivially simple reason that lockdowns are an incredibly stupid idea.
                      Regardless, Trump managed a full economic recovery. There was not even a recession in 2020 – just near zero growth for a year.

                      That alone is remarkable. Bush did not manage that with the housing crisis. Nor did Obama.

                      When Biden was elected – we were told happy days were here again. They are not. Inflation is rearing its ugly head.
                      We have had 3 straight months of high single digit anualized inflation – that was not supposed to hit until late 2020.
                      We are supposed to be well into a recovery right now – but we are not. Real growth is lower than inflation.

                      I am still reading that some democrats do not expect to be massacred in 2022 – because the economy must recover.
                      I honestly hope that is true. I would rather have idiot democrats run the country than have low growth.

                      But the economy is not magical. It responds to policies, it responds to incentives.
                      We had 8 years of abysmal growth under Obama.

                      Biden did actually inherit and economy poised for a strong recovery. And we may still get one anyway – despite Biden and democrats.
                      Look arround – people are FED UP – with your nonsense. Those governors that have not released their states – despite death rates that are higher than periods we were told we MUST lockdown, are all facing recall efforts.

                      People are angry – AT YOU.

                      You lied to them about masks. You lied to them about lockdowns, you lied to them about the origens of Covid. You lied to them about Hunter Biden. You lied about Laffeyette Park. You have lied to them over and over about pretty much everything – and they are increasingly fed up.

                      Since Jan. 6. DHS and the Biden administration has repeatedly warned us that armed white supremecists were about to march on the capital to reinstate Trump. Yet each prediction has fizzled. Now we find that the FBI and capital police had intelligence that armed hordes were going to descend on the capital on Jan 6. Yet the only guns and shooting on Jan 6 was a murder by the capital police.
                      So you locked down the capital to stop some airhead in a bearskin cape ? In the impeachment the left claimed that 800 people broke into the capital – but we now know that atleast 309 of those were invited in by the capital police at ONE door – and there are several other places people were invited in.

                      Is there anything you are capable of telling the truth about ?

                  2. Trump has three MAGA rallies scheduled beginning in June.


                    You coming? Hmmmm?

              2. Biden is Xi’s beeyotch.

                Trump was right about a lot of things.

                Trump’s voters were real people.

                Biden’s 81 million votes were not.

                1. You’re a moron.

                  Trump lied through his teeth and wasn’t right about anything

                  81,000,000 came to their senses and voted out a charlatan and a fraud.

                  Trump couldn’t con his way out of a pandemic.

                  You just stay in your hole and let the smart folks take charge.

                  1. If so you could cite specifics
                    You have been wrong about every claim you have made so far

                    Trump voters were real people

                  2. Biden took office with the gift of a vaccine from trump
                    And still has almost as many deaths in 100 days as trump in a year

                  3. I’m actually quite smart. You are just jealous. And wrong. Again.

                    It’s okay. We’ve heard you have perfect hair, so that makes up for you being a moron. In California, anyways.

                    1. “You aren’t intelligent at all.

                      You can’t even spell.

                      You’re old and probably borderline senile.”


                      Describe your perfect hair for us.

                    2. “Most jokers my age are bald.”

                      Trump has a full head of perfect hair, too.

                      Biden has plugs.

                    3. Everything about Trump is phony – from Ivanka’s nose to Melania’s tits to anything that comes out of Trump’s mouth.

                      America is becoming a Third World kleptocracy of cheaters, liars and frauds.

              3. Did SNL ever do even one show opening skit mocking Biden this season? Like they would do for every other president?

                Any comedians mocking Biden? Hmmm?

            2. He is as also closer to right about HCQ
              It is more effective than masks

              And the bleach thing is true
              There is a medical paper on it

              Of course the left thinks bleach means Clorox

                    1. He was wrong about everything and that’s why he was voted out.

                      The dumbest 50% of America had their vulgarian candidate for four years with the expected result: Economic, humanitarian and constitutional catastrophe.

                    2. Economic growth over trumps 4 years averaged higher than Obama or bush
                      Even with c19
                      People accross the world were not killing each other as they are now
                      Can you cite an instance trump violated the constitution
                      I can easily specify numerous examples of either Obama or biden acting outside the law or constitution

                    3. The “dumbest 50%” of the country has been right about far more than you

                  1. Actually he was right about both
                    HCQ is more effective to an masks
                    By numerous studies in the us and Europe for both
                    And there is a published study that effectively treated covid with bleach

                    Bleach is an oxygenating agent
                    Not just Clorox

                    Ben you are not smart

                    But you could check your facts before posting

                  2. Trump was NOT voted out…over half the country knows who won and it wasn’t Biden…stealing is stealing…conservatives will figure out a way to steal it back…most of the time when stuff is stolen we have insurance to replace the stuff so it’s just an inconvenience unless someone gets hurt in the theft…well folks are being hurt and killed by BLM…why do you think gun and ammo sales are through the roof!

          3. I am not a fan of tarrifs.

            But I am a fan of data.

            Yes, Trump tarrifs resulted in China going elsewhere for agricultural products.

            But the global market for agriculture is not sufficiently elastic to have the results you claimed.

            US agricultural production of good that were previously shipped to china did not decline.

            They did not decline because the market is not sufficintly elastic and the goods china purchased elsewhere were purchased by others from the US.

            I know that math and particularly economics are beyond leftists – but you could try.

            Some math and history lessons from Deutsche Bank.


          n May 2019, analyses from varying organizations were released. A May 2019 Goldman Sachs analysis found that the consumer price index (CPI) for tariffed goods had increased dramatically, compared to a declining CPI for all other core goods.[194] A CNBC analysis that month found that Trump had “enacted tariffs equivalent to one of the largest tax increases in decades,” while Tax Foundation and Tax Policy Center analyses found the tariffs could offset the benefits of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017 for many households.[19][20][21] The Tax Foundation found that if all existing and proposed tariffs were fully implemented, the benefits of the Trump tax cut would be completely eliminated for all taxpayers through the 90th percentile in earnings.[195] Another May 2019 analysis conducted by the National Taxpayers Union warned that the existing and proposed additional tariffs, if fully implemented, would constitute the largest tax increase of the post-war era.[196] According to an analysis by Peterson Institute for International Economics economists, American businesses and consumers paid more than $900,000 a year for each job that was created or saved as a result of the Trump administration’s tariffs on steel and aluminum.[197] The cost for each job saved as a result of the administration’s tariffs on washing machines was $815,000.[197]

          Analysis conducted by Deutsche Bank estimated that Trump’s trade actions had resulted in foregone American stock market capitalization of $5 trillion through May 2019.[198]

          Trump announced on August 1, 2019, that he would impose a 10% tariff on $300 billion of Chinese imports beginning September 1; four days later the Chinese Commerce Ministry announced that China was halting imports of all American agricultural goods. American Farm Bureau Federation data showed that agriculture exports to China fell from $19.5 billion in 2017 to $9.1 billion in 2018, a 53% decline.[199] The figure was $21.4 billion in 2016.[200]

          A September 2019 Federal Reserve study found that tariffs Trump imposed through mid-2019, combined with the policy uncertainty they created, would reduce the 2020 real GDP growth rate by one percentage point.[201]

          A study by four economists published in October 2019 by the Quarterly Journal of Economics estimated that U.S. consumers and firms who buy imports lost $51 billion (0.27% of GDP) as a result of the 2018 tariffs. After accounting for increases in government tariff revenue and gains to U.S. producers, the study authors estimated the aggregate U.S. real income loss to be $7.2 billion (0.04% of GDP).[24] The study found that “retaliatory tariffs resulted in a 9.9% decline in U.S. exports within products.”[24] The study also found that workers in heavily Republican counties suffered the most from the trade war, because retaliatory tariffs focused on agricultural products.[24]

          1. Why would anyone read wikipedia when the facts are readily available.

            US agricultural production was higher throughout the Trump administration than when he took office.

      2. Aparently you are not paying much attention.

        Faucci, the NIH, Obama, and the US federal govenrment are all likely complicit int he creation of C19.

        Yes, China should be worried – but so should the US.

        US research started this. US money is likely responsible for finishing it.

        While it is not established with absolute certainty this came from the Wuhan labs, and US research and money.

        The zoonotic theory is pretty much obliterated. It has never taken more than a few months to find the actual natural source for a virus of natural origens. The bats virus that is inarguably an ancestor to C19 does not exist naturally within 1000 miles of Wuhan.
        There has never been a bat to human to human transmission of that virus.

        The wet market thesis failed.

        Current estimates are a 1:13000000000 chance the virus had natural origens.

        Conversely the lab leak thesis is now about 95% likely.

        The chinese – hopefully accidentally produced and released this on the world – and the US was complict.

        One of Obama’s last acts before leaving office was to restore funding for the Wuhan institute of Virology.

  16. This type of thinking has been going on for years in public school education and i would not be surprised if there is a connection somewhere. Years ago i was given an inservice in speaking about children with either disabilities or some impairment that does not define the child. We were given time to adjust but were corrected or written up if we spoke incorrectly. So we could not say, the deaf child wrong. Correct. The child who does not hear. .Or. the autistic child. The child with autism. Put a country first and same thing. Do not say the turkish. Kid. Say The kid from Turkey. This suit is just an extension of this

    1. Many of the language rules the left makes up last days at most – before they make up new ones.

      1984 was supposed to be a warning, not a howto manual.

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