As the government deals with what may prove the worst oil disaster in the history of the country in the Gulf of Mexico, oceanographer and chemical engineer Rush Limbaugh has gone public with his theory that “enviornmental wackos” may be responsible and that pouring oil into the ocean is something that the ocean can handle naturally with intervention by the government. He also insisted that oil spills are natural and should not cause undo concern.
Limbaugh noted “The carbon tax bill, cap and trade, that was scheduled to be announced on Earth Day” and “hardcore environmentalist wackos” were looking for ways to oppose Obama’s plans for more nuclear power and offshore drilling: “What better way to head off more oil drilling, nuclear plants, than by blowing up a rig? I’m just, I’m just noting the timing here.” So here is a glimpse into the mind of Rush Limbaugh: environmentalists fear an oil spill on the coast so, to avoid such spills, they blow up a rig to cause a spill on the coast.
Limbaugh also encouraged the public to stop fearing oil spills and learn to embrace them as natural as the ocean water they pollute: “The ocean will take care of this on its own if it was left alone and left out there. It’s natural. It’s as natural as the ocean water is.”
Presumably, Limbaugh made these statements from Costa Rica where he promised to go if the health care bill was passed, here.
In the meantime, Bill Kristol told Fox News that the problem is that we are not drilling close enough to shore, here.
For the full story, click here.
Dear Rush,
you’re funny.
But I really do hope that after you die, you come back as a seagull.
Yours,
Maaarrghk!
http://www.mms.gov/omm/pacific/enviro/seeps1.htm
http://www.springerlink.com/content/bya6g7r7ceebanrl/
Natural Marine Oil Seepage
R. D. Wilson 1, P. H. Monaghan 1, A. Osanik 1, L. C. Price 1, and M. A. Rogers 1
1 Geology Function at Esso Production Research Company, Houston, Texas
The probable range of seepage into the marine environment is 0.2 x 106 to 6.0 x 106 metric tons per year. Within this range the best estimate for the present marine seepage worldwide is on the order of 0.6 x 106 metric tons per year. This estimate is based on the presumption that only a few other areas around the world are as seepage-prone as southern California. Measurements of seeps and seepage rates are too few to allow an accurate estimation by observation and measurement techniques alone. Seepage potential can, however, be related to geologic criteria, and these provide sound bases for marine seepage assessment.
On the basis of this estimate, areas of high seepage potential contribute about 45 percent of the worldwide seepage, areas of moderate seepage about 55 percent, and areas of low seepage less than 1 percent. The situation varies somewhat from ocean to ocean. In the Pacific Ocean, areas of high seep potential are by far the major contributors. In the Atlantic, Indian, Arctic, and Southern oceans, areas of moderate seep potential are most significant because areas of high seep potential are relatively rare in these realnis. The circum-Pacific area is the area of greatest seepage; it contributes about 40 percent of the world’s total.
he may have a point about possible ecoterrorism:
http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/Ecoterrorism.asp?LEARN_Cat=Extremism&LEARN_SubCat=Extremism_in_America&xpicked=4&item=eco
http://www.adl.org/main_Extremism/university_of_california_animal_rights_extremism.htm
It most probably was not eco terrorism but it certainly is not outside the realm of possibility based on previous incidents.
As with so much that is wrong in our country, this is another legacy of unbridled greed that has infected this country for 30 years. BP and other oil companies successfully lobbied to prevent the regulation that would have required the automatic underwater shut-off valve that would have prevented this disaster and which is required by most other countries that permit off-shore drilling.
Over the past 18 months or so, we’ve been subjected to the unravelling of the brand of conservativism championed by Reagan and GWBush and exposing it as the failure it is. Conservative have zero credibility. We’ve seen the devastating impact in the mortgage markets, financial services sector, mining, oil, health insurance and the list goes on. This infection even affects Supreme Court decisions. When you give industries free rein, they WILL take advantage and America will suffer.
rcampbell:
it did have a shut off valve on the sea floor, it is called a Blowout Preventer (BOP). When I worked offshore 30 years ago they had them. Although we were only drilling in 400′ of water not 5,000′. They are also operated by hydraulics maybe something else now. the are called blind rams and shear rams. they cut the drill stem and theoretically cut the flow. You can operate them from the rig floor and probably from the rig control room as well.
From the WSJ (4/28/2010)
Leaking Oil Well Lacked Safeguard Device
By RUSSELL GOLD, BEN CASSELMAN and GUY CHAZAN
Excerpt:
The oil well spewing crude into the Gulf of Mexico didn’t have a remote-control shut-off switch used in two other major oil-producing nations as last-resort protection against underwater spills.
The lack of the device, called an acoustic switch, could amplify concerns over the environmental impact of offshore drilling after the explosion and sinking of the Deepwater Horizon rig last week.
The accident has led to one of the largest ever oil spills in U.S. water and the loss of 11 lives. On Wednesday federal investigators said the disaster is now releasing 5,000 barrels of oil a day into the Gulf, up from original estimates of 1,000 barrels a day.
U.S. regulators don’t mandate use of the remote-control device on offshore rigs, and the Deepwater Horizon, hired by oil giant BP PLC, didn’t have one. With the remote control, a crew can attempt to trigger an underwater valve that shuts down the well even if the oil rig itself is damaged or evacuated.
The efficacy of the devices is unclear. Major offshore oil-well blowouts are rare, and it remained unclear Wednesday evening whether acoustic switches have ever been put to the test in a real-world accident. When wells do surge out of control, the primary shut-off systems almost always work. Remote control systems such as the acoustic switch, which have been tested in simulations, are intended as a last resort.
Nevertheless, regulators in two major oil-producing countries, Norway and Brazil, in effect require them. Norway has had acoustic triggers on almost every offshore rig since 1993.
The U.S. considered requiring a remote-controlled shut-off mechanism several years ago, but drilling companies questioned its cost and effectiveness, according to the agency overseeing offshore drilling. The agency, the Interior Department’s Minerals Management Service, says it decided the remote device wasn’t needed because rigs had other back-up plans to cut off a well.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423504575212031417936798.html
Elaine:
how does that acoustic switch work if the BOP is blown apart or somehow incapacitated by the explosion? If the rams in the BOP have been damaged and cant be closed how is a back-up switch going to work?
If my TV is broken the remote control is not going to work.
Byron–
“how does that acoustic switch work if the BOP is blown apart or somehow incapacitated by the explosion?”
I guess we’ll never know if it would have worked or not because an acoustic switch was never installed. I didn’t claim the acoustic switch would have been able to shut off the spillage of oil into the Gulf. I posted the article because I thought it was something we could think about/discuss. The WSJ certainly isn’t considered to be the most liberal newspaper.
You’ll notice the following paragraph in the article I posted:
“The efficacy of the devices is unclear. Major offshore oil-well blowouts are rare, and it remained unclear Wednesday evening whether acoustic switches have ever been put to the test in a real-world accident. When wells do surge out of control, the primary shut-off systems almost always work. Remote control systems such as the acoustic switch, which have been tested in simulations, are intended as a last resort.”
Video Shows Feds Knew Of Potential Ecological Disaster Immediately After Rig Explosion
A National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration video, shot as officials coordinated response to the Deepwater Horizon disaster, shows that federal officials immediately worried that the oil well could leak up to 110,000 barrels per day, or 4.6 million gallons.
The video appears on a federal Web site.
It was filmed in Seattle, at NOAA’s Western Regional Center, as scientists and federal officials in Seattle, Houston and New Orleans engaged in telephone conferences, according to a companion document on the Web site.
It took President Obama 12 days to visit the disaster area today.
Yesterday, The New York Times reported that Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano was not aware the Defense Department had equipment for dealing with oil slicks. The White House defended their non-response today.
And then there’s this…
On April 29th, Ron Gouget, who once managed Gulf spill response teams, publicly pilloried the administration’s response to the tragic oil rig explosion in the Gulf of Mexico. Gouget helped create the 1994 plan that allowed expedited burning of oil as soon as a major spill had occurred — without having to wait for permission or approvals.
video
http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/topic_subtopic_entry.php?RECORD_KEY%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=entry_id,subtopic_id,topic_id&entry_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=813&subtopic_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=2&topic_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=1
Maaarrghk!,
That’s a terrible thing to say about seagulls.
Lots of blame to go around.
Following is an excerpt from an LA Times article. I wonder what Rushbo will make of Halliburton’s chief executive being called to testify.
Halliburton in spotlight in gulf spill probe
Investigators look at the company’s role in cementing the deepwater drill hole in the Gulf of Mexico. Transocean and BP also face questioning.
May 01, 2010|By Margot Roosevelt, Los Angeles Times
Investigators delving into the causes of the massive gulf oil spill are examining the role of Houston-based Halliburton Co., the giant energy services company that was responsible for cementing the deepwater drill hole, as well as the possible failure of equipment leased to British Petroleum.
Two members of Congress, Reps. Henry A. Waxman (D-Beverly Hills) and Bart Stupak (D-Mich.), called on Halliburton on Friday to provide all documents relating to “the possibility or risk of an explosion or blowout at the Deepwater Horizon rig and the status, adequacy, quality, monitoring, and inspection of the cementing work” by May 7.
Halliburton Chief Executive David Lesar is scheduled to testify before Waxman’s energy and commerce committee on May 12, along with top executives Lamar McKay of BP America Inc. and Steve Newman of Transocean Ltd., which leased the drilling rig to BP.
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/may/01/nation/la-na-oil-spill-investigation-20100501
Gulf of Mexico oil spill: Burning should have started a week ago, former NOAA official says.
MOBILE, Ala. — Federal officials should have started burning oil off the surface of the Gulf last week, almost as soon as the spill happened, said the former oil spill response coordinator for the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.
Ron Gouget, who also managed Louisiana’s oil response team for a time, said federal officials missed a narrow window of opportunity to gain control of the spill by burning last week, before the spill spread hundreds of miles across the Gulf, and before winds began blowing toward shore.
He also said the heavy use of dispersants, which cause oil to sink, has likely knocked so much oil into the water column that portions of the Gulf may be on the threshold of becoming toxic to marine life. Add in the oil spreading into the water as it rises from the seafloor, and Gouget said he expected officials would have to think about limiting the use of the dispersants.
“There was a threshold of about 35 part per million for oil in the water. Above that, white shrimp larvae died in the laboratory. I don’t know where the levels are now in the Gulf, but that is something they will have to keep an eye on,” Gouget said.
Gouget, now an environmental consultant with Windward Associates in Seattle, was part of the group that created the 1994 plan designed to allow federal responders to begin burning oil as soon as a major spill occurred, without an approval process.
http://blog.al.com/live/2010/04/burning_should_have_started_a.html
Document: BP didn’t plan for major oil spill
By CAIN BURDEAU and HOLBROOK MOHR, Associated Press Writers Cain Burdeau And Holbrook Mohr, Associated Press Writers – Sat May 1, 2:38 am ET
Excerpts:
MOUTH OF THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER – British Petroleum once downplayed the possibility of a catastrophic accident at an offshore rig that exploded, causing the worst U.S. oil spill in decades along the Gulf Coast and endangering shoreline habitat.
In its 2009 exploration plan and environmental impact analysis for the well, BP suggested it was unlikely, or virtually impossible, for an accident to occur that would lead to a giant crude oil spill and serious damage to beaches, fish and mammals.
***********
BP’s 52-page exploration plan for the Deepwater Horizon well, filed with the federal Minerals Management Service, says repeatedly that it was “unlikely that an accidental surface or subsurface oil spill would occur from the proposed activities.”
And while the company conceded that a spill would impact beaches, wildlife refuges and wilderness areas, it argued that “due to the distance to shore (48 miles) and the response capabilities that would be implemented, no significant adverse impacts are expected.”
Robert Wiygul, an Ocean Springs, Miss.-based environmental lawyer and board member for the Gulf Restoration Network, said he doesn’t see anything in the document that suggests BP addressed the kind of technology needed to control a spill at that depth of water.
“The point is, if you’re going to be drilling in 5,000 feet of water for oil, you should have the ability to control what you’re doing,” he said.
Although the cause of the explosion was under investigation, many of the more than two dozen lawsuits filed in the wake of the explosion claim it was caused when workers for oil services contractor Halliburton Inc. improperly capped the well — a process known as cementing. Halliburton denied it.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_louisiana_oil_rig_explosion
BIL.
I would like to take this opportunity to apologise fully and without reservation to all seagulls.
(Except the one that might be a re-incarnation of Rush).
BIL–
Now I suppose you’ll expect me to apologize for my “Irangutan” comment a few days ago at another post!
“BP’s 52-page exploration plan for the Deepwater Horizon well, filed with the federal Minerals Management Service, says repeatedly that it was “unlikely that an accidental surface or subsurface oil spill would occur from the proposed activities.”
I guess someone is going to be eating those words for a very long time.
Elaine,
As primates, it’s all in the family so no apology required.
Although Halliburton and BP got some ‘splainin’ to do.
Again.
Byron.
Those figures 0.2 x 106 to 6.0 x 106 you give for natural hydrocarbon seepage does the “106″ you mean 10 raised to the power 6 by any chance?
If you do not have superscripts available you can use computing input number format eg 0.2 E+6 or 0.2 * 10E+6instead.
Rush, who??
Byron…how long does concrete take to set up underwater?
And what is the ‘seepage’ rate of Deepwater Horizon…now? Do manmade wells have ‘acceptable’ seepage?
Byron,
I wonder how big of a percentage of yearly volcanic activity the recent eruption in Iceland makes up.
Or, to give another (hypothetical) example: Every year, the majority of antelope deaths in Africa are due to ‘natural’ causes (predators, diseases, etc.) One moderately sized herd is hit by hunters on safari, that kills the majority of males in the herd. While in the whole of Africa the antelope population might be fine, and the whipping out of this particular herd is only a small percentage of total antelope deaths, it has a real and severe effect on the local ecological system.
CM:
quite right should read 10^6, sorry about that and good catch. it shows up on the web site so I guess the format did not copy when I pasted.
Rush, the magic seagull lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist in a land called ……
Maaarrghk!
Rush return as a seagull? I’d prefer he be reincarnated as an earthworm–soft, pink, spineless and wriggling around in and subsisting on dirt. You know, a slightly higher life form that’s akin to his present being.
Byron…how long does concrete take to set up underwater?
They use a slurry of hydraulic cement or mellose that can start to get hard in a matter of minutes.
US Orders Blackout Over North Korean Torpedoing Of Gulf Of Mexico Oil Rig
A grim report circulating in the Kremlin today written by Russia’s Northern Fleet is reporting that the United States has ordered a complete media blackout over North Korea’s torpedoing of the giant Deepwater Horizon oil platform owned by the World’s largest offshore drilling contractor Transocean that was built and financed by South Korea’s Hyundai Heavy Industries Co. Ltd., that has caused great loss of life, untold billions in economic damage to the South Korean economy, and an environmental catastrophe to the United States.
Most important to understand about this latest attack by North Korea against its South Korean enemy is that under the existing “laws of war” it was a permissible action as they remain in a state of war against each other due to South Korea’s refusal to sign the 1953 Armistice ending the Korean War.
To the attack itself, these reports continue, the North Korean “cargo vessel” Dai Hong Dan believed to be staffed by 17th Sniper Corps “suicide” troops left Cuba’s Empresa Terminales Mambisas de La Habana (Port of Havana) on April 18th whereupon it “severely deviated” from its intended course for Venezuela’s Puerto Cabello bringing it to within 209 kilometers (130 miles) of the Deepwater Horizon oil platform which was located 80 kilometers (50 miles) off the coast of the US State of Louisiana where it launched an SSC Sang-o Class Mini Submarine (Yugo class) estimated to have an operational range of 321 kilometers (200 miles).
On the night of April 20th the North Korean Mini Submarine manned by these “suicidal” 17th Sniper Corps soldiers attacked the Deepwater Horizon with what are believed to be 2 incendiary torpedoes causing a massive explosion and resulting in 11 workers on this giant oil rig being killed outright. Barely 48 hours later, on April 22nd , this North Korean Mini Submarine committed its final atrocity by exploding itself directly beneath the Deepwater Horizon causing this $1 Billion oil rig to sink beneath the seas and marking 2010’s celebration of Earth Day with one of the largest environmental catastrophes our World has ever seen.
To the reason for North Korea attacking the Deepwater Horizon, these reports say, was to present US President Obama with an “impossible dilemma” prior to the opening of the United Nations Review Conference of the Parties to the Treat on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons (NPT) set to begin May 3rd in New York.
This “impossible dilemma” facing Obama is indeed real as the decision he is faced with is either to allow the continuation of this massive oil leak catastrophe to continue for months, or immediately stop it by the only known and proven means possible, the detonation of a thermonuclear device.
Russian Navy atomic experts in these reports state that should Obama choose the “nuclear option” the most viable weapon at his disposal is the United States B83 (Mk-83) strategic thermonuclear bomb having a variable yield (Low Kiloton Range to 1,200 Kilotons) which with its 12 foot length and 18 inch diameter, and weighing just over 2,400 pounds, is readily able to be deployed and detonated by a remote controlled mini-sub.
Should Obama choose the “nuclear option” it appears that he would be supported by the International Court of Justice who on July 8, 1996 issued an advisory opinion on the use of nuclear weapons stating that they could not conclude definitively on these weapons use in “extreme circumstances” or “self defense”.
On the other hand, if Obama chooses the “nuclear option” it would leave the UN’s nuclear conference in shambles with every Nation in the World having oil rigs off their coasts demanding an equal right to atomic weapons to protect their environment from catastrophes too, including Iran.
To whatever decision Obama makes it remains a fact that with each passing hour this environmental catastrophe grows worse. And even though Obama has ordered military SWAT teams to protect other oil rigs in the Gulf of Mexico from any further attack, and further ordered that all drilling in the Gulf of Mexico be immediately stopped, this massive oil spill has already reached the shores of America and with high waves and more bad weather forecast the likelihood of it being stopped from destroying thousands of miles of US coastland and wildlife appears unstoppable.
And not just to the environmental catastrophe that is unfolding the only devastation to be wrecked upon the United States and South Korea by this North Korean attack as the economic liabilities associated with this disaster are estimated by these Russian reports to be between $500 Billion to $1.5 Trillion, and which only a declaration of this disaster being an “act of war” would free some the World’s largest corporations from bankruptcy.
Important to note too in all of these events was that this was the second attack by North Korea on its South Korean enemy, and US ally, in a month as we had reported on in our March 28th report titled “Obama Orders ‘Immediate Stand-down’ After Deadly North Korean Attack” and which to date neither the Americans or South Korea have retaliated for and giving one senior North Korean party leader the courage to openly state that the North Korean military took “gratifying revenge” on South Korea.
And for those believing that things couldn’t get worse, they couldn’t be more mistaken as new reports coming from Japanese military sources are stating that North Korea is preparing for new launches of its 1,300 kilometer (807 miles) intermediate range ballistic “Rodong” missile which Russian Space Forces experts state is able to “deploy and detonate” an atomic electromagnetic pulse (EMP) device, and which if detonated high in the atmosphere could effectively destroy the American economy for years, if not decades, to come.
http://www.eutimes.net/…/us-orders-blackout-over-north-korean-torpedoing-of-gulf-of-mexico-oil-rig/
First, the syphilitic pustular should come back as a dung beetle. Rolling turds around is what he does so he would only have to learn to do it with his legs instead of his tongue.
Second, several large oil companies (Dutch Petroleum for one) install those remote shut offs even when not required because it helps them during maint. and gives them another line of defense when the inevitable happens.
Third, new estimates indicate that the 5k BBL/day guesstimate is very low. Satellite photos of the slick show growth that indicates much more, perhaps enough to out perform the Exxon Valdez twice a week.
Gyges:
so what is your point? I have posted an abstract that says there is oil seepage from underwater structures in various areas of the world. The oceans take care of this seepage through what ever natural process it uses.
Will there be local ecological problems, I would imagine so given the quantity of oil released. Will that decimate shore birds and the shrimp industry and gulf fisheries? Probably not. Even if we didn’t do anything they would still recover because oil is a natural product and if that abstract is to be believed oil has been leaking for quite awhile and we still have fish, shrimp and shore birds.
Commercial fishing probably decimates populations of shrimp and fish more than this spill will.
Byron,
“Commercial fishing probably decimates populations of shrimp and fish more than this spill will.”
Really Byron, really?
Not that it matters, but I find your ongoing defense of the indefensible to be truly troll-like; quite amazing even for you.
Byron,
How soon would you be willing to eat shrimp from the Gulf? Seeping spread out over undersea structures throughout the world is entirely different from 5K+ barrels of oil being spewed out of one wellhead every day. This is not a little thing that will be cleaned up and all better in a couple of years. I’m guessing that we probably wont know what the full impact of this spill is for a couple of years and the effects will last decades at a minimum.
Byron,
You claim to be an engineer. No engineer or educated person I know would speculate wildly in the manner that you are now.
Bdaman,
You are a pathetic scam master. Most everything you post is tainted with some form of conspiracy, fraud, or fringe thought/theory.
Truly Byron, your hard won credibility seems to be in full retreat. What’s up with that? Hanging around with bdatroll must be rubbing off on you. We expect contradictory and nonsensical assertions from him.
Oh for godz sake Rush, every try to get on or anywhere near an offshore oil rig!
joe
CEJ:
This was an accident, accidents happen. BP needs to clean it up and pay people for their loss of revenue.
I think drilling for oil is ok and that there are some risks that are worth taking. This was certainly more than was to be expected. And it will take a toll on shore birds and the gulf ecosystem, but they will survive and recover.
If you dont like drilling for oil I can certainly understand but just because I think humans have a right to make a living doesnt mean I am a troll. Those oil rigs put tens of thousands of people to work directly and indirectly. And provide for literally hundreds of thousands of people either through direct family ties or by supporting the families of the men and women who work in the local economy supporting the oil industry and their families as well. You shut down oil and gas production and you will have a real disaster and one that doesnt involve birds, fish and shrimp.
Pardon me if I think humans are more important than pelicans and have a greater right to life and prosperity than a red snapper or a shrimp.
“If, after the failure of such accusations as “Capitalism leads you to the poorhouse” and “Capitalism leads you to war,” the New Left is left with nothing better than: “Capitalism defiles the beauty of your countryside,” one may justifiably conclude that, as an intellectual power, the collectivist movement is through.”
“The Left: Old and New,”
Return of the Primitive: The Anti-Industrial Revolution, 170
I would say give it until November, 2010
As a Former Federal Law Enforcement Officer who post under his real name at numerous other websites to give himself more credibility to the subjects discussed, do not think something is not possible without first looking at the possibilities. I think thats why the president dispatched SWAT Teams to all other rigs because he aint discounting anything either.
Thanks for the comment
FFLEO:
well I am learning from everyone else here making the same speculations on the opposite end of the spectrum.
Byron,
You’ve got your head pretty far deep in the sand there. You want to play the oil seepage card? Fine, prove that the oil seepage in the area in question is greater than the spillage. THEN you can say “well the area’s used to it.” Right now you might as well be saying “you can’t die from an infected wound, because you have bacteria living on your skin.”
No one knows with absolute certainty what happened. NO ONE
Byron,
We should look at the costs (environmental and economic) of ALL industries in the light of day – as long as businesses can despoil assets that they don’t own in the name of their own profit we cannot have a truly free market. And we’re not talking about ‘capitalism defiles the beauty of the countryside’, we’re talking about ‘pollution destroys the viability of the ecosystem’. It is not out of the realm of possibility for pollution (and its secondary effects) to cause the collapse of modern society or reduce the ‘carrying capacity’ of the Earth (I think you would agree that damaging the Earth to the point where if couldn’t support more than, say, 1 billion people would be a bad thing).
Bdaman,
How does a SWAT team prevent a torpedo attack on an oil rig?
The Exxon Valdez was about 53 million gallons of that amount they speculate about 21,000 gallons still remain. The majority of the species have recovered. While this isn’t exactly a perfect scenario it is not the doom and gloom that everyone here seems to be predicting.
http://www.evostc.state.ak.us/facts/index.cfm
Gyges:
“You’ve got your head pretty far deep in the sand there.”
Come on you mean up my a . . .
How does a SWAT team prevent a torpedo attack on an oil rig?
They don’t my point is to FFLEO nothing is off the table yet. Lets not forget that a South Korean Naval Ship was sunk a few weeks ago and retrieved from the depths of the ocean. It was suspected that a torpedo sunk the ship. The Oil Rig that was sunk was a floating rig/ship. It was not moored in place. It was controlled by a gps system with thrusters.
Maybe the sinking of the South Korean Naval Ship was a test run for the rig in the GOMEX. Never say Never.
Dr. Slarti to get a better idea of a floating rig here’s one being piggy backed to location.
http://acrigs.com/Nautilus-Dry-Tow.jpg
Bdaman and Byron,
I do not want to stifle conversation and I will write more later on. I just request that you fully attribute any copy/paste. Then, please qualify your comments with some statement; such as, this sounds like bunk, but…, or, I will live and die by my statement because I am sure of it given my 20 years as an oil field engineer or production manager (which I can verify), or, this sounds crazy to me, but do you think it is plausible?, et cetera.
Ideals and thought are important; unfounded fringe statements presented as fact are not.
Thanks.
Slarti,
SWAT surround the torpedo, drops in a radio, and puts a negotiator on the line. If that fails, they ride in on their sharks with lasers mounted on their heads and take no prisoners.
And how do we know it wasn’t the sea life itself that “sabotaged” the well? Perhaps the Aquatic Liberation Front, a school of malcontent dissident groupers allied with some subversive shrimp, known for their industrial espionage.
I take that back. The image linked above is THE Deep Water Horizon, the ship that sunk.
Bdaman,
Sorry, but your conspiracy theory article doesn’t really pass the smell test – why would a nuclear weapon be the only way to stop the wellhead? Why not conventional explosives? I doubt very much that you could be sure that explosives would collapse the wellhead (they would have to be placed outside of it since the oil gushing out would prevent actually putting the explosive inside the borehole). Remember explosives leave craters, not mounds. A detonation (of any sort) COULD collapse the borehole, but it could also make the problem much worse and it seems like an irresponsibly reckless action to me. It’s a sign of too much Hollywood ‘science’ to think that this kind of problem can only be solved with a nuke. Ockham’s razor points to an industrial accident and a ‘failsafe’ system that wasn’t. The government should (and I believe will) investigate all the possibilities, but wild speculation about improbable and impossible scenarios is pointless right now. And this conspiracy theory you posted doesn’t hold together when just a minimal amount of thought and reason are brought to bear on it…
Buddha,
I was unaware that they had deployed the unit of sharks with frickin’ lasers strapped to their heads. I stand corrected.
FFLEO I did
http://www.eutimes.net/…/us-orders-blackout-over-north-korean-torpedoing-of-gulf-of-mexico-oil-rig/
You can always google for yourself.
Buddha,
Are you sure that it wasn’t the Liberation Front of Aquatica?
Bdaman,
Please fully quote what is a direct copy/paste so there is no confusion of who said what.
Thanks.
Bdaman,
Don’t you think that the difference between an explosion (likely in the superstructure) and a torpedo hit (necessarily at water level or below) would be immediately obvious?
Sorry, that didn’t work. To indent a long quote, use:
(less than) blockquote (greater than)
and to end it use:
(less than) /blockquote (greater than)
Where (greater than) = ‘>’
and
(less than) = ‘<'
Dr. Slarti do you think that after the sinking of the South Korean Naval Ship, raising the remnants and towing it to shore it would be immediately obvious that a torpedo sunk the ship. I would think so, but they are still investigating the incident.
OK …I will admit this…I don’t waste my time with the fathead…just the headline is enough for me…so I did not finish reading what the amazing super duper man with a microphone might have to say about the oil spill…maybe he will get lucky and the “chocolate milk ” will wash up on the shoreline of his Florida house…then he won’t have to pay for the stuff, that makes him so cozy with the girls….I have no idea what I just said , but I do know this, I broke my “no Rush head rule”….damm
Bdaman, I can tell you enjoy dropping crap in the toilet. I’ll say this, the scenario seems highly unlikely but you’ve raised my suspicion about the incident.
Bdaman,
You’re comparing apples to oranges and avoiding my question.
Sorry Dr. Slarti, I’ll be back, have an errand I forgot to run. back n a bit.
Bdaman,
Re: post by ‘Tom Carey’ at 4:05 pm
Did you just forget to change your pseudonym back after posting as a sock puppet?
All of the following is quoted from:
http://www.w3schools.com/html/tryit.asp?filename=tryhtml_q
A blockquote quotation:
The browser inserts line breaks and margins for a blockquote element.
A short quotation:
Notice that the browser inserts quotation marks around the short quotation (Does not work in IE).
Slartibartfast,
Very obvious about the ‘name’ and that happens frequently within the ‘birfer’ thread and elsewhere here. It should be outlawed.
Slart, FFLEO,
You mean an obvious troll is obviously a troll? Next you’re going to tell me that somebody with a record of dishonesty is lying.
FFLEO,
I know. My personal policy is to treat every different pseudonym as a different poster and to judge arguments on their quality rather than the number of adherents that they seem to have. I just thought that Bdaman’s gaffe was funny so I pointed it out.
Thanks for the description of blockquote and quote. Some other commands that can be used with the
(less than) command (greater than)
(less than /command (greater than)
syntax:
b – bold
i – italics
strong – pretty much the same as bold
There are a bunch more, but blockquote, bold and italics seem to me to be the most useful for clarity in your posts (if you happen to be writing 5,000 word posts in which you quote other posters and other websites frequently they come in handy…).
Gyges,
I was just doing my impression of Nelson from the Simpsons – i.e. pointing at Tom Carey/Bdaman and saying, ‘Ha Ha!’
FFLEO:
I thought it was pretty apparent what my personal opinions are/were. I also have posted the references when they are not my personal thoughts.
One doesn’t have to have an advanced degree to engage in speculation based on things they have read and thought about.
As I posted above about the economic implications of shutting down off shore drilling in the Gulf. I don’t have to be John Kenneth Galbraith or Ludwig Von Mises to call that one. It is self evident based on certain economic principles that I have learned from reading various economists.
Noted alternative comedian Rush Limbaugh “weighs in” on the worst disater of its kind in my lifetime.
This guy just kills me
Byron,
I don’t think your posts were confusing, but addition clarity doesn’t hurt. As far as drilling in the gulf, do you think that requiring the acoustic switches that Brazil and Norway do is economically unfeasible? Why wasn’t it done already if industry is so good at regulating itself? After all, economically it certainly would have given BP a chance to save billions of dollars ($14 Billion was one figure I saw on the news today). That doesn’t include a decade of bad PR. (if you have the choice of two gas stations with identical prices are you going to the BP station or the other one?)
Byron,
The problem with your argument is the cost of pollution – the cost is not paid by the industry and thus amounts to a hidden subsidy. I thought you were against corporate welfare.
Bdaman has failed to mention conjecturable relocation of the Bermuda Triangle and possible migration of voodoo spells from New Orleans as elements in the conspiracy.
Blouise,
Don’t give him any ideas – I don’t want to have to debunk some massive conspiracy theory about how the Illuminati planted Barack Obama’s birth announcement, killed Kennedy, faked the moon landing, engineered the controlled demolition of the World Trade Center and arranged for the North Koreans to torpedo the Deepwater Horizon as part of a Voodoo spell to relocate the Bermuda Triangle and bring about a socialist one-world government. Why don’t you just go and work on breeding a mini-mammoth with anti-freeze for blood…
maybe rush wants the oil to wash up around his house. if it kills the sea turtles that are nesting there then he can keep his lights on all night. also as a proponent of tort reform he can sue bp.
Slarti:
I am definitely against corporate welfare. I have stated many times above that BP/TransOcean should pay for the clean-up and any lost wages for economic injury suffered as a result of the spill.
I heard on the radio today and have not verified it yet so I don’t know if it is true. The host was saying that BP (maybe any oil company?) only has a 75 million dollar liability for clean-up per agreement with US government. I may have gotten the figure wrong it could be 75 billion. So if this agreement actually exists and the host has it correct you and I are already on the hook for clean-up.
I would think 75 million wouldn’t go very far when dealing with stuff like this.
As far as the switch goes, if it works why not. It would be a triple redundancy as they already have a dead man switch if the drill string is disconnected. But if there is a chance it might save lives and prevent something like this then why not. Personally if I owned a big drilling company I would pay the additional money for the switch if it actually might do something. You have rig tenders anyway and I would think you could have one or 2 ships that went around to rigs during critical procedures and just stand by.
The cost would be additional insurance and at a relatively small cost. But then I am a little conservative and these oil guys are risk takers. But do you really need 3 parachutes?
I’m back Dr. Slarti, what ever you do don’t call me Tommy.
Tommy can you hear me?
Byron,
Apparently we do need three parachutes and allowing the oil industry to self-regulate on safety matters was a big mistake. And are you against corporate welfare in the form of allowing companies to pollute. Put another way, can I start a trash collection business and cut costs by dumping garbage in your back yard?
Now you know
Slarti:
I say let them pollute to their hearts content but then sue the bejeebers out of them to make them clean it up. I dont think government should play a part except as a referee.
It might not work but the system we have now isnt working either. We fine companies that pollute. In fact BP had a big fine for some pollution they caused in Alaska a few years ago. I see how effective that was in preventing the current trouble.
http://www.adn.com/2009/03/31/743678/state-feds-seek-hefty-fines-for.html
Tom Carey:
why do you keep posting Who songs on a site about oil spills?
http://www.aolnews.com/opinion/article/opinion-the-oil-slick-you-cant-see/19460901
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ocean_acidification
Byron,
I’m sorry, but that’s just dumb. No one (except maybe the government which you don’t seem to want to do anything) has grounds to sue for pollution of public air and water and I haven’t seen much luck getting companies to clean up their messes after the fact. If you don’t want me to dump garbage in your back yard just because I can make more money that way, why is it okay for hog farms to make more money by dumping toxic waste into ponds? (which leach into the water table) How can the free market account for something if you don’t put a price tag on it? If pollution is a ‘cost of doing business’ then keeping it off of the balance sheet is bad accounting – what kind of free market is that?
Byron,
I apologize for calling your comment above dumb, but could you please explain to me how a free market can exist if companies can dump pollution into the environment at no cost.
Slarti:
whose land/water is hog waste polluting? Someone owns it. Air you might be right about, but if there is a known disease that is caused by a certain chemical that is manufactured by company x and you come down with it. . .
Why would you dump hog waste into ponds? I would process it and make methane to run my farm and use the by-product to fertilize my fields. A little aerobic or anaerobic digestion, a little microwave action and viola methane and fertilizer. Reduced cost of pork production means money in my pocket and maybe even excess gas to sell to my neighbors.
Not like the brazen arc of electricity,
With conquering volts astride massive cables in the sky;
Here at our green washed, manure gates shall stand
A mighty torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of pig shit. From her flame
Glows farm-wide welcome; her mild flame command
The anaerobic digesters that twin hog barns frame.
“Keep ancient ideas, your chemical fertilizers!” cries she
With silent lips. “Give me your pig shit, your chicken shit,
Your masses of refuse yearning to be gas,
The wretched garbage of your productive farm.
Send these, the products of your enterprise to me,
I lift my flare beside the golden tank!”
Byron,
Some facts about hog farm waste:
http://www.nrdc.org/water/pollution/ffarms.asp
The fact of the matter is that interconnectivity of the ecosystem means that pollution (of any sort) can’t be limited to property that the polluter owns (and there is no indication that anyone even tries). This is the same brakage in the profit/cost or risk/reward feedback mechanism which brought us the financial crisis. You are not truly an advocate of free markets if you don’t see that this linkage must be fixed. These systems can be mathematically shown to be unstable without proper feedback mechanisms. Do you believe in something for nothing and corporate welfare or do you agree with me?
Slartibartfast
Blouise,
Don’t give him any ideas – I don’t want to have to debunk some massive conspiracy theory about how the Illuminati planted Barack Obama’s birth announcement, killed Kennedy, faked the moon landing, engineered the controlled demolition of the World Trade Center and arranged for the North Koreans to torpedo the Deepwater Horizon as part of a Voodoo spell to relocate the Bermuda Triangle and bring about a socialist one-world government. Why don’t you just go and work on breeding a mini-mammoth with anti-freeze for blood…
===============================================================
The mini-mammoth is out ’cause Maaarrghk! wants me to cuddle it.
After having spent hours reading the thread with all the birther nonsense and “naturalized” citizen debate, I figured he’d fall for the voodoo or Bermuda Triangle line and then try to get my name and address and ….
Yeah, you’re right
Slarti:
I took no offense.
In my view they cannot, it would cost them in legal fees. In addition what is waste anyway? It is a by product of production as such it is a waste of money as well. If i can use that waste to make money I would be silly not to try. Did you know that waste fat is picked up by a company in/near Emporia, VA and converted into animal food? Or that Kingsford Charcoal was created by Henry Ford out of packing crates?
http://www.kingsford.com/about/index.htm
If you can turn trash into cash why would you get rid of it? Certainly some companies produce toxic waste that needs to be disposed of appropriately/properly but the remedy is the court system if they pollute (at least in my opinion). As we see now big companies use the need for money by politicians as leverage when making deals about waste disposal. Give a pol a thousand bucks and he is your BFF for life.
You should be thinking about this type of thing with your venture. It could save you a good deal of money which could be used to expand which will put more people to work and provide additional societal benefits.
See Slarti Capitalism is all about rational self interest but guess what the by-product of that is? A healthy and wealthy society. Collectivism is what causes the problems, when people aren’t free to chose it isn’t good.
If U.S. officials had followed up on a 1994 response plan for a major Gulf oil spill, it is possible that the spill could have been kept under control and far from land.
The problem: The federal government did not have a single fire boom on hand.
burn2.jpgView full size(AP Photo/U.S. Coast Guard, Petty Officer 1st Class Justin Sawyer)This April 28, 2010 image made from video released by the Deepwater Horizon Response Unified Command, shows an in situ burn in the Gulf of Mexico, in response to the oil spill after the explosion on the Deepwater Horizon. The “In-Situ Burn” plan produced by federal agencies in 1994 calls for responding to a major oil spill in the Gulf with the immediate use of fire booms.
But in order to conduct a successful test burn eight days after the Deepwater Horizon well began releasing massive amounts of oil into the Gulf, officials had to purchase one from a company in Illinois.
When federal officials called, Elastec/American Marine, shipped the only boom it had in stock, Jeff Bohleber, chief financial officer for Elastec, said today.
At federal officials’ behest, the company began calling customers in other countries and asking if the U.S. government could borrow their fire booms for a few days, he said.
A single fire boom being towed by two boats can burn up to 1,800 barrels of oil an hour, Bohleber said. That translates to 75,000 gallons an hour, raising the possibility that the spill could have been contained at the accident scene 100 miles from shore.
http://blog.al.com/live/2010/05/fire_boom_oil_spill_raines.html
plug it with rush… solve two problems at once…
If they would have rushed to plug it in the first place, we wouldn’t be having this discussion in the first place.
How would environmental whackos approach the rig without being noticed? “Look fellas, here comes Greenpeace. Put on some tea water.” Hmmm, maybe an inside job? Like “Hey, I could blow up the station and kill a bunch of us and ruin the Gulf coast too! That’s it. Then Rush Limbaugh can fire up the ninnies and say oil in the water is natural. Hell, the sea birds and turtles LIKE it. And then everyone will sing the national anthem.”
definetly the work of eco-terrorists, the proof lies in this huffenpuff post below
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/andy-borowitz/goldman-sachs-reveals-it_b_558774.html
‘The news about Goldman’s bet against the Gulf comes on the heels of embarrassing revelations that the firm had taken a short position on Lindsay Lohan’s acting career. More here. ‘
Is this what they do all day? Bet on the Lindsay Lohans of the world? Jesus….
How would environmental whackos approach the rig without being noticed?
It was an inside Job
Anyone who actually believes that BP will be made to pay the actual costs of the damage of this spill should read this Greg Palast article on the Exon Valdez oil spill.
Exxon after a scorched earth battle through the courts has managed to pare back its payout for this spill to much less than it saved by not having the saftey equipment and procedures in place that it had agreed to.
Carlyle:
who let them do that?
We consumers are the ones who are going to pay for it. Gas prices are going to be outrageous this summer.
Personally, when I heard about it, the first thought that came to mind was that probably someone who worked for the oil company did it as reason to raise prices.
Any way the oil companies can find to raise prices, they will.
Why wouldn’t an environmentalist do it? Lots of those tree huggers want us all to drive little golf cart sized electric cars! They could use this as an example to say, “see, this is why we all need to drive cars made out of aluminum that are the size of golf carts and run on rechargeable Energizer batteries”.
Honestly though, I kind of think the oil company did this themselves. They can write off the lost oil as a business loss and still raise the price of oil for us consumers. Summer’s coming and the timing is just right to raise prices. It’s all about money.
Byron,
Who “enabled” them via graft?
Vicious meet circle.
What you fail to grasp Byron in you analysis of the corporatist/graft/politician loop is causation and the proper relationship between business and government.
The causation is corporate funded lobbyists. The causation is politicians being compliant. But what are the root causes of those behaviors? Simple greed. When the causation is human nature you structure your systems to compensate for weaknesses in human nature – like greed. Otherwise, why bother. You mistake my placing prime causal blame in this loop on the corporations for letting the pols have a walk on their bad behavior. The reason the pols come in second is they are trapped in a system that has been long broken by the corporate funded lobbyists to guarantee they stay attached to the corporate teat. There is a reason people say PAC means “Purchase A Candidate”.
As corporations are creatures of the state, they are subject to regulation by the state no matter how much you protest. Without government, corporations are nothing more than a gang with letterhead. And now that they’ve declawed the regulatory and criminal punishment systems (via lobbyist graft lest you take your eye off the ball again) meant to keep the corporate criminals in check you see an climate in which Exxon (and Goldman and AIG and BP and blah corporatist shitheels blah) commit crimes or create great damage to the public through their negligence and malfeasance and go unpunished.
That is injustice of the highest order.
Methinks you protest too much, Mr. Vested Interest, and your cries of “oh the poor beleaguered corporations!” grows tiresome in the never-ending flow of news of corporate bad action after bad action. The “right to make money” doesn’t trump the right to good governance and many a revolution was started by some nitwit making the mistake that the “right to make money” was prime to society when it was only prime to him. It’s a behavior called greed enhanced with narcissism. It’s sacrificing the world on the alter of ego worship.
We don’t need just more regulation of the offending industries. We need enforcement and we need stiff criminal penalties for bad acting corporate officers to be served in prisons that are anything but of the country club variety. That way when we find the BP or Halliburton weasel who wanted to save a dime so badly they compromised on safety and nail them to the wall, VP, CFO or other alphabet soup not withstanding.
“and then nail”
“Honestly though, I kind of think the oil company did this themselves”
Maybe it was a friend of this guys. Pakistani’s work in the Oil feilds too.
U.S. citizen from Pakistan arrested in Times Square bomb case
By Anne E. Kornblut, Jerry Markon and Spencer S. Hsu
Tuesday, May 4, 2010; 8:22 AM
Maybe it was the Tooth Fairy too, badtroll.
I’ll say this once in simple language since you cannot grasp the concept: Terrorism depends upon ease of access to a target. A wellhead on the sea floor has lots of one thing: lack of easy access.
The likely cause here is still component failure and/or negligence no matter how paranoid you wish to spin it.
Unless your theoretical Paki is also Aquaman.
This guy could have had something to do with it.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/05/03/video_shows_pakistani_taliban_leader_hakimullah_mehsud_alive_threatening_attacks_against_us.html
Seems our officials who claim to be intelligent and work for that office are not so intelligent. They claimed to have killed him in a drone attack several months ago but this new video has surfaced and he’s alive and kickin.
In it Mehsud threatened to retaliate against the United States within a month for the killing of Islamist militant leaders by drones according to a transcript of the video.
Speaking of drone attacks, we all know that the administration has no problem in the use of drone attacks against American citizens who may happen to be of Pakistani decent hanging out with other Pakistani’s.
There’s a new Poll out
Obama drone joke: Was it offensive?
“You have to wonder why in the world the president’s speech writers would think it was a good idea to throw a joke about predator drones into the president’s speech during the White House Correspondent’s Dinner, given that an estimated one-third of drone casualties, or between 289 and 378, have been civilians,” wrote Adam Serwer at the American Prospect.
Voting is still open
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/05/obama-drone-joke-was-it-offens.html?hpid=artslot
If they were willing to fly planes into buildings don’t think they wouldn’t be willing to blow up an oil rig.
or what, you think 9-11 was a one time event?
It’s estimated that if the bomb went off in time square approximately 4 to 500 people could have been killed or maimed.
It’s also estimated that if the Fort Hood Shooter could have got just one more shot off, he could have killed one more person.
If they were willing to fly planes into buildings don’t think they wouldn’t be willing to blow up an oil rig.
Correction:
If they were CAPABLE of flying planes into buildings don’t think they couldn’t be capable of organizing to blow up a ship. They already hijack them in large numbers.
Speaking in Pashto, but with English subtitles, Mehsud assures viewers he was not killed in a missile strike or any other way, referring to specific reports of his death as lies and propaganda.
“(Praised be to God), on the 4th day of April 2010, I give good news to the Muslim (world) about being alive and healthy,” Mehsud says in the nearly nine-minute clip.
The second clip is two minutes, 19 seconds long, and has a still picture of Mehsud next to a map of the U.S. showing explosions in three cities coast to coast, according to IntelCenter, a U.S.-based militant media monitor.
The map is not detailed enough to identify which cities.
A voice that sounds like Mehsud’s says the tape was recorded on April 19. Speaking Urdu, he says the group’s main targets from now on are U.S. cities, and that “good news will be heard within some days or weeks.’
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1271225/Pakistan-Taliban-leader-alive.html
My but you are a fear mongering lil’ troll today.
You don’t seem to be scared, not one of your traits. I know your type, if your scared you’ll say your scared.
Buddha:
I dont think he is fear mongering, more like public service announcement.
Time Square Bomber a Tea Party Member?
Mayor Bloomberg, Bomber Was Mad About ObamaCare.
New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg agreed the Times Square car bombing was likely “homegrown”. In an interview excerpt run on Monday’s CBS Evening News, to speculate it could have been placed by “somebody with a political agenda who doesn’t like the health care bill or something. It could be anything.”
It’s PSA
Whoops yet again. You would think at some point they would get tired of being wrong.
Shahzad, 30, was due to appear in federal court later on Tuesday to face charges of “driving a car bomb into Times Square on the evening of May 1,” officials said. Had the bomb detonated, many people could have died, experts said.
“He’s admitted to buying the truck, putting the devices together, putting them in the truck, leaving the truck there and leaving the scene,” the law enforcement source told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity.
“He’s claimed to have acted alone. He did admit to all the charges, so to speak,” the source said, adding that investigators were still looking into his activities during a recent trip to Pakistan.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKTRE6410CK20100504
Shazam
I just read this interesting article this morning:
NOAA Warned Interior It Was Underestimating Threat Of Serious Spill
by Dan Froomkin (Huffington Post, 5/3/2010)
Excerpt:
National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration officials last fall warned the Department of Interior, which regulates offshore oil drilling, that it was dramatically underestimating the frequency of offshore oil spills and was dangerously understating the risk and impacts a major spill would have on coastal residents.
NOAA is the nation’s lead ocean resource agency, and the warnings came in its response to a draft of the Obama Administration’s offshore oil drilling plans. The comments were Web-published in October by the whistle-blowing group, Public Employees for Environmental Responsibility (PEER).
But NOAA’s views were largely brushed aside as Obama went ahead and announced on March 31 that he would open vast swaths of American coastal waters to offshore drilling — a plan now very much in doubt as a blown-out BP well in the Gulf of Mexico spews out an estimated 200,000 gallons of oil daily, for the 13th straight day.
The memo, which NOAA Administrator Jane Lubchenco wrote was based on the agency’s “extensive science, management and stewardship expertise related to oceans, coasts and marine ecosystem” recommended that Interior conduct “a more complete analysis of the potential human dimensions of offshore production.”
NOAA complained that the draft report overstated the safety of offshore oil production by using information on frequency of spills from 1973 to 2004. NOAA pointed out there was a “substantial increase in spill volume in 2005, primarily due to spills associated with Hurricanes Katrina and Rita. Some of the damaged rigs and pipelines damaged during the 2004 and 2005 hurricane seasons continue to have episodic releases, and repairs have not been fully completed.”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/03/noaa-warned-interior-was_n_561615.html
Some things never change!
http://readersupportednews.org/video/4-video/1639-dick-cheneys-role-in-oil-catastrophe
Here’s an excerpt from another Huffington Post article:
Gulf Oil Spill: Government Regulator Downplayed Environmental Impact Of Spill
by Marcus Baram (Huffington Post, 5/3/2010)
Excerpt:
In the wake of the growing environmental catastrophe in the Gulf of Mexico, BP is being blamed for discounting the potential for a massive oil spill and underestimating its effects.
But the federal agency tasked with oversight of offshore oil drilling may be even more responsible for understating the impact of a spill in the environmentally-sensitive area.
In a 2007 environmental impact statement for the Western and Central Planning Area Sales, which includes the Macondo Prospect where the Deepwater Horizon rig exploded on April 20, the Interior Department’s Minerals Management Service downplayed the potential for environmental damage.
In the document which covers oil drilling leases from 2007-2012, MMS assesses the potential impact of oil spills and blowouts on wetlands, marine mammals, commercial fishing, economic impacts, and water quality, among other factors:
- “Offshore oil spills resulting from a proposed action are not expected to damage significantly any wetlands along the Gulf Coast… Overall, impacts to wetland habitats from an oil spill associated with activities related to a proposed action would be expected to be low and temporary.”
- “The effect of proposed-action-related oil spills on commercial fishing is expected to cause less than a 1 percent decrease in standing stocks of any population, commercial fishing efforts, landings, or value of those landings. Any affected commercial fishing activity would recover within 6 months. At the expected level of impact, the resultant influence on commercial fishing activities from a proposed action would be negligible and indistinguishable from variations due to natural causes.”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/03/gulf-oil-spill-government_n_561646.html
I have an idea about how to make BP pay. More later.
Speaking of Rush to Judgement
Christine Pelosi, daughter of Speaker Nancy Pelosi, and Timothy Stoltzfus Jost, professor, Washington and Lee University, need to apologize to conservatives for their outrageous claims in The Politico following the attempted Times Square bombing.
Christine Pelosi, attorney, author and Democratic activist
This is what a terrorist can look like: a balding white man in his 40s. Thanks to an alert street vendor and an NYPD officer who ushered in local and federal law enforcement, the Times Square would-be bomber was a bust. So far. They saw the parked car, engine running, hazards blinking, driver departing — in other words, they profiled behavior, not people. Take note, Arizona.
Timothy Stoltzfus Jost, professor, Washington and Lee University
I think the politics of this incident will turn heavily on who is found to be responsible. If, as seems unlikely, the bomb is linked to South Asian or Middle Eastern terrorists, questions will again arise as to whether the Department of Homeland Security is doing all it can do to keep us safe. If, as I believe is much more likely, the bomb was placed by a right-wing lunatic, it seems to me that questions need to be raised as to whether the right-wing media bear some responsibility for stoking the delusions of such people through their relentless and often unfounded attacks on the Obama administration and the federal government.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0510/36700.html
Wahoo,
Christine Pelosi has nothing to apologize for – what she said is correct. Profiling behavior led to the detection of the inept car bomb. Professor Jost is also in the clear as he made a qualified conditional statement:
“If, as I believe is much more likely…”
His belief seems to have turned out to be wrong (note my own qualification), but that doesn’t effect the truth of his statement. Neither of them have any reason to apologize. If there were some quantitative scale measuring the relative need to apologize whenever someone said something, both of these ‘gaffes’ would measure in the micro-Palins, nano-Rushes, or femto-Bachmans.
Move over, Pat Roberston, make way for Rick “the secessionist” Perry.
Rick Perry: Oil spill may be ‘act of God’
by Jake Sherman (Politico, 5/3/2010)
Texas Gov. Rick Perry Monday offered a stern warning against halting oil drilling in the Gulf of Mexico in the wake of a massive oil leak, and he raised the question of whether the explosion was an “act of God.”
The Republican governor, speaking at the Chamber of Commerce in Washington, warned against a “a knee-jerk reaction” to the spill and said the government doesn’t know what caused the leak, which took 11 lives and threatens the Gulf coast’s vast fishing industry.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0510/36691.html
If Texas has not changed it statute and Haliburton is found to be liable then the maximum exposure they are looking at is 50 or 250 Thousand Dollars, I forget which.
Texas had a Governor that used the maritime limitation for an oil spill when one of his offshore rigs collapsed and it ended up costing the state over 11 million dollars in the late 70′s or early 80′s. Then Texas punished him like they do all good politicians, he was re-elected. I suppose it is a cost of doing business.
What was it I said yesterday,
If they were CAPABLE of flying planes into buildings don’t think they couldn’t be capable of organizing to blow up a ship. They already hijack them in large numbers.
Somali pirates hijack China-bound oil tanker
(Reuters) – Somali pirates on Wednesday hijacked the Russia-owned oil tanker MV Moscow University bound for China 350 miles off the coast of Yemen with 23 Russian crew and crude oil worth $52 million on board.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6441NF20100505?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true
AY:
that was Bill Clements the owner of TransOcean Sedco or just Sedco back in the 70′s and 80′s. I think he sold to Schlumberger (Schlumbershea) a French company which provides the same services as Haliburton.
That knowledge is a few years old so things could have changed.
yes we did it to show you that you are the real ecoterrorists! wee little earthers, obama dunsum laudnum, and kimjunglee collaborated to blow up the rig and pollute the gulf to show the world how bad oil is. we were willing to sacrifice an entire ecosystem and possibly annihilate whole specis to make our point.
it should make perfect sense once you think about it. tuurrists have no respect for life, enviros are tuurrrists, therefore enviros blew up the rig. course wee little earthers needed help from the big guys who although ostensibly pro-capitalist (obama) and pro-totalitarian cult of presonality (kimjunglee) are really sleeper anarchists working in collusion with georgeo sora$$.
I like this from (Bdaman) “It took President Obama 12 days to visit the disaster area today.
Yesterday, The New York Times reported that Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano was not aware the Defense Department had equipment for dealing with oil slicks. The White House defended their non-response today.”
Can you imagine if Georgy was still at the helm. By now the blogs would have tried,convicted and convinced Pelosi to start impeachment hearings!
12 DAYS! Oh my goodness, I wonder if Obama (Soetoro) was even aware that the rig blew up? After all, he was very busy outlining “HIS” new proposal for CAP and TAX that would have made way for MORE OIL RIGS IN THE GULF!
Something else you folks (too) quickly wiped out of your minds about this article that (of course) seeks to tear apart Rush simply for making a possible (keen) observation. The GREEN nuts and global warming thugs were in fact looking for ANY possible way they could to STOP Obama from making this move. They had as much passioante hate for him, because of his willingness to allow more rigs, as they have every morning for Sarah Palin.
Don;t write off the greenies just yet as being the ones WHOLLY responsible for this. After all, just think how successful this IS GOING TO BE in making sure off shore oil rigs are soon a thing of the past.
And one last thing. Before all you freaks spew anymore of your vitriolic hate for “conservatives” and oil drilling, I suggest you ALL put everything you own up for sale that runs on anything derived from its use. That means, going caveman. Because the fact your on a computer spewing your dumbness, proves, YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM!
BILLBO,
Sorry, but the facts just don’t line up with the hypothesis that it was terrorists of any sort. (and North Korean torpedos are right out!) Someone (Bdaman, I think) linked to a caller who was on the Deepwater Horizon during the explosion who described the sort of accident that is know to happen occasionally after cementing. FFLEO said that an independent source had told him that the accident described was one of the possible causes of the explosion. Furthermore, given the option of blaming eco-terrorists vs. a possible $20+ billion liability how many oil executives would fall on their sword? Not the three I saw testify to congress on Tuesday, I’m guessing. So why don’t you just take the inane propaganda that you got from Rush, Fox News and the birthers and try to spread your lies somewhere else (referring to President Obama as Soetoro is a dead giveaway and it’s been amply demonstrated here that President Obama is a natural born citizen regardless of whether or not he was adopted by Lolo Soetoro). Or better yet, you could actually try to do some unbiased research and learn the truth.
That should be: “Someone [...] linked to a caller on the Mark Levin show who was on the Deepwater Horizon…”
Dr. Slarti the unofficial cause, as of now, is a gas bubble that came up the pipe and exploded/ignited when it reached the surface. We can begin to rule out all other possibilities. The whole point of this exercise is as the title to the post says, Rush To Judgment
Isn’t that a typo?
Aren’t those B’s supposed to be D’s? And that’s one too many L’s.
As with all industrial accidents, look first for a natural cause, then to the last person who worked on it.
cough cough cough Halliburton cough cough cough
Buddha,
That’s a nasty frog in your throat – I hope you’re not coming down with something…
Bdaman,
Sorry, it’s just in my nature to stand on the bridge and tell stupid ideas, “You shall not pass!”
Dr. Slarti shame on you
HORN ISLAND, Miss. – Federal wildlife officials are treating the deaths of six dolphins on the Gulf Coast as oil-related even though other factors may be to blame.
Blair Mase (MACE’) of the National Marine Fisheries Service said Tuesday that the carcasses have all been found in Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama since May 2. Samples have been sent for testing to see whether a massive oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico helped kill the dolphins.
Mase and animal rescue coordinator Michele Kelley in Louisiana said none of the carcasses has obvious signs of oil. Mase also said it’s common for dead dolphins to wash up this time of year when they are in shallow waters to calve.
The Associated Press found dolphins swimming and playing in oily waters off Louisiana last week.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100512/ap_on_re_us/us_oil_spill_dolphins
Two good ol’ boys were hired to help clean up the Gulf spill around the 26 mile stretch of beach surrounding Walton County, Florida, including Sandestin. The video of their “hay technique” has over 200,000 views so far.
Check out how their hay method works to trap oil on the water in the above video.
Expanded Offshore Drilling Will Be Part of Senate Climate Bill, Says Lieberman
The Senate climate bill to be unveiled tomorrow will have provisions to expand domestic oil drilling, including revenue sharing for states that agree to allow more production off their shores, according to one of the measure’s lead co-sponsors.
http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2010/05/11/11greenwire-expanded-offshore-drilling-will-be-part-of-sen-80847.html
Bdaman:
that is very interesting video, did you notice that the one guy said he hoped to make some money? Also he wanted to burn it for energy. He could sell the oil soaked hay to a power plant.
He isnt only doing this for the environment. Leave it to a couple of guys looking to make some money to solve a problem.
Obviously they would need to test this in the Gulf with the unrefined oil but it certainly looks promising and cheap.
As as simple an idea it is, it will never work. It needs approval of the EPA and it needs to be regulated.
Bdaman:
Yes that is the sad part, is the hay proper hay and probably some environmentalist will bitch about seeds. however I think they said you can cut the hay before it goes to seed.
It will be 10 years before they can use it. Although maybe if they ram it through it will only take 7.5 years.
I’m like, you know, Rush like just knows stuff and is a really large celebrity. So, like, just give ‘im a chance to like, say stuff. ‘Cause maybe you don’t know but his show saved my life one time… er it was Jon Stuart, I guess.
does noone in america know how to use a gun?
John Stuart Mill once said that: “Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative.”
What’s really ironic about this new breed of Fox News/Clear Channel conservative is that they’re not at all conservative in the Barry Goldwater sense of the term. They’re military adventurists, deficit spenders, enviromental despoilers, and religous zealots.
Their hypocrisy is boundless and their stupidity is legion. They rail mindlessly about welfare but can’t grasp that historically these so-called entitlements (like food stamps & SSI) aren’t gifted whimsically by bleeding hearts but begrudgingly granted as “riot insurance” for the ruling class.
They’re organically incapable of understanding that the real welfare problem is corporate welfare which is inextricably integral to this peculiar social arrangement which they imagine, very jingoistically, is the pinnacle of human achievement.
By contrast the Libertarian fantasy of free markets is a myth that Edith Hamilton should have written about. Markets aren’t free & never have been. Markets are for artificially manipulating commodity prices. America’s economic prowess has always come by way of protectionism and public subsidies of private corporations, not to mention imperialist turpitude.
Free market ideology has always been what Uncle Sam preaches for others, not what he himself practices. Hogs, milk, grain, oil, virtually all major industries are publically subsidized to the hilt in one form or another and the social costs are enormous, hidden in every facet of daily life. Just like with the previous S&L disaster, this latest credit default swap disaster, the Afghanistan disaster, and this BP oil disaster, the secret of contemporary capitalism is that the profits are privatized while the losses are socialized.
The fact that this built-in to the system corporate welfare is so cleverly obscured by the commercial press on behalf of the approximately 2% that own about 80% of the wealth in this country is so great and unprecedented a propaganda victory for this parasitic minority that even Goebbels himself would be enormously proud.
(As an aside he’d be especially proud of this “Support Our Troops” mantra that everybody feels compelled to bow to since it implies WHATEVER they do they must be supported without question.)
The Lord knows I love Rush, but he is mistaken. We all know that really, God is smiting the gulf for allowing homosexuals and illegal aliens!