Montana Issues 6000 Permits To Kill Up To 30,000 Wolves . . . For A Wolf Population Of 625

220px-Canis_lupus_lupus_qtl1We recently saw NBC air an outdoors program showing a NRA lobbyist shooting an elephant in the face and then celebrating with champagne. Given the outcry over the show, he may want to check out Montana where hunters can make a real killing with a $19 license to kill up to five wolves. That is slightly above $3 a wolf. The problem is that the state has issued 6000 permits which would allow the killing of 30,000 wolves. The entire wolf population however is down to 625 in the entire state.


These seem to be pure thrill kills since no one is going to use the meat and you will be able to kill as many as five wolves.

To assist in what looks like a slaughter in the making, the state extended the period to hunt the wolves. If just roughly 2 percent of the hunters succeed, Montana will have wiped out the entire population of wolves. One can only conclude that that is the purpose of this overkill policy. In the meantime, people are clamoring to get in on the kill . . . and to be able to say that they helped wipe out a species in the state for less than the cost of two movie tickets.

The Center for Biological Diversity released the video below on the hunting program.

82 thoughts on “Montana Issues 6000 Permits To Kill Up To 30,000 Wolves . . . For A Wolf Population Of 625

  1. I think with the cost of the equipment some of the folks use…. You could buy a nice winter beater…..

    There’s a difference between thinning and extinction of a species….. But it’s been done before on American soil….

  2. Hunters only need a target not rationale or necessity. The thirst for blood is more highly evolved in this group than the thirst for reason.

  3. Well, I’m a hunter, and I believe that a relocation program would best serve the interests of the communities involved and the animals. Why not live capture, then spay and neuter, and release the animals into an area that would benefit from a natural predator? To be candid, I would love to own one as a pet, and cubs young enough to domesticate would be very similar to any other canine breed. I do not hunt for trophies, I hunt for meat. I consume what I harvest. I am willing to wager that a few wolves neutered, spayed, and released into areas overrun with feral hogs, would cull that destructive but tasty population, while being compassionate. Where there is a will, there’s a way.

  4. I’m not a hunter but I agree with Brittius, but then he seems a hunter in the true sense of the label. I think we see another breed of “hunter” that likes killing things for the sake of killing things.

  5. Gentlemen,

    Keep in mind this is Montana and cattle is king. I’m sure ranchers who place a few (out of thousands of heads of) cattle above a robust and diverse ecosystem had a lot to do with this particular idiocy.

  6. I knew a wolf once, she was a magnificent animal and friendly. A sh*tbird of a vet kept her by herself in a cage in his backyard in the middle of a major city. Ostensibly for the purpose of wolf studies.

    That poor creature was so lonely; it made you want to cry.

    Humans always want to control their environment much to their regret often times. I think this is one of them. And the elk, deer and antelope population will suffer for it. But maybe not since hunting of those beasts is ongoing.

  7. Professor Turley, you know I love ya man, but the tactic of rolling out the proverbial injured kid in a wheelchair isn’t working on me & the articles are devoid of enough pertinent facts to base one’s opinion on.

    But I’m glad you posted this none the less as it’s a great chance for others
    to think more deeply about these issues.

    I am a friend to wildlife, nature, people & pets.

    A supported a good govt wolf program, not the piece oh crap we have today.

    Just like when I presented you guys the Dog Whisper video to make you better owners for your pets, here below is a link you really should study if you truly give a dam about wolves, wildlife, national parks, forest.

    Brittius, you have some good ideas, but people taking a wolf as a family pet is a horrible idea.

    A wild animal will always remain a wild animal!!!!

    (Signed: A Ray’s Arrow in Steve Irwin’s heart!!)

    http://www.defendruralamerica.com/DRA/Wolves.html

  8. The wolf is the only mammal that carries the special gene allowing uninhibited diversity. All domestic dogs come from the wolf. Breeds of dogs can easily be bred for all types of reasons, and the hybrid is instant. The Russians have bred bomb sniffing dogs for that SPECIFIC purpose. Their sense of smell is superior, but just for explosives! And, unlike any other breed of bomb sniffers, which have to be pointed to smell an object, these incredible animals TAKE THE LEAD. They smell, bark once, and sit.

    Our culture has gone more than a little nuts w/ creating breeds. In just the last 50 years the number of breeds has tripled, I believe. Most of this info is from a very good National Geographic doc. So, w/ this in mind, we need to protect the original gene of this animal w/ some instincts and qualities better than us humans.

  9. Brittius:

    I dont know, if I was a wolf I would steer clear of ferral hogs. those are some mean dam animals.

    Owning a wolf would be pretty neat but you would need a couple or at least some dogs for company. Big dogs.

  10. I’m not sure if some people realize just how big of an animal some of these wolves are.

    Not all are huge, but you see from the pictures above many are 2,3 times larger then a male German Shepherd.

    These wolves are impressive as hell in person.

    Me, a full grown man wouldn’t stand a chance against just one of those wolves in the wild unarmed.

    They are cool in person though.

    If you’ve ever seen the after effects of what a kid looks like after just a dog mulled the kid’s face should know to be damn serious about protecting the Kid & the Animal from trouble that none of us want!

  11. Ya, I’m not sure what to think about that delisting issue, but I was using the point of the video about regardless of people’s emotional feelings we still have to rationally manage wildlife for future generations.

  12. Maybe we could start the Save the Elk & Wolves Foundation?

    It’s mission statement would be to get congress to allow the feeding of DC polecats, Wallst Bankers/Insurance creeps & Lawyers to wolves so they don’t have to eat so many Elk.

    It’d likely be a win-win-win-win.

    What do you think?
    :)

  13. It’s been a while since I 1st viewed these talks.

    There’s one in there you may wish to skip as the speaker as trouble choking up.

    One that I found very relevant to forest management is Steve Brink talk.

    I haven’t seen the pictures from aftermath of California’s forest fires this year, but Steve has some interesting pictures from the past up til a few years ago.

  14. More of a kill-off than a hunt. And I suspect there is no 3 round ammo capacity for the rifle law either on these wolves. Being small game, they are probably under the .25 caliber requirement. So, see a pack of wolves, unload on them with your AR-15 and a 30 round magazine. Oops, you shot 10 of them in this freefire zone?, no worry you remembered to bring your buddy who can tag the extra five. You can be real hunters when the state wants to kill off the herd.

  15. Darren, I know you’re correct that there are to many irresponsible hunters.

    I believe these issues are almost the same as traffic laws.

    Just because there are idiots driving we don’t consider banning cars.

    The other day some idiot here went speeding around a stopped school bus & hit 3 or 4 kids.

    The Laws caught up with him, if he’s found guilty which I think he will be, his butt is cooked & he’ll also be a felon.

    No more voting or guns for him! Good!

  16. I am a hunter and that video of big game hunters is outrageous and only a fool would be taken in by it. Their obvious goal is to make the wolf extinct in the US once again. They succeeded once and they wish to do it again. They view ALL the US as THEIR sporting preserve and anything that takes “their” game away is an enemy.

    it is also outrageous that they want the government to save them time, money, and effort so that they don’t have to do the hard work in going out and HUNTING. They want to have enough game by their cabins so that they can walk out a few miles and shoot their trophy, and go back and have some drinks. The ranchers have the old time method that worked for thousands of years against predators. They are called shepherds. Of course, they would have to be paid, and that costs money. If they don’t want to pay for people to take care of their herds, there are breeds of dogs that do just as well.

    When wolves become numerous enough, THEN I am in favor of issuing licenses to hunt them. When they have to use helicopters to hunt wolves, that alone tells me that they are not so numerous that they need to be hunted. There are lots of species such as alligators, cougars, that ARE threats and need to be hunted once again. There were no documented attacks by wolves on people until recently when there was ONE in the entire USA.. Every year in CA there are people killed by cougars, but the idiots voted against allowing hunting them there. If there were similar numbers like that for wolves, I too would be in favor of hunting them again.

  17. ** Founding Fathers’ Tavern Closed by Government Shutdown

    Vince Lattanzio
    NBC
    October 3, 2013

    An iconic Philadelphia restaurant has been forced to close its doors and turn away booked parties because of the government shutdown.

    City Tavern at 3rd and Walnut Streets in the Old City section of the city has been told it must close until the U.S. Congress passes a spending bill.

    The restaurant, which opened for the first time in 1773 and was frequented by the nation’s founding fathers, sits inside Independence National Historical Park and the building is owned by the U.S. National Parks Service.

    Both have been shut down since Tuesday when the federal government began its new fiscal year without agreeing on how to fund non-essential agencies. Nearly 200 park employees were also furloughed because of the funding issue. **

  18. Wolves in Montana improperly managed:

    The current wolf proposal awaiting commissioner action and approval clearly flies in the face of the best available science and the public trust doctrine. While elk populations continue to increase and depredation continues to decrease throughout Montana, one has to ask the logical question: Why is Montana FWP in a three-state race to the bottom in science-based wolf management?

  19. Wolves are part of the ecosystem. Nature is cruel in its own way, but what wolves do best is help evolution along by thinning out weak and sick animals, leaving the stronger ones. They also keep down the population of varmints.

    There are not that many reported incidents of wolves attacking humans. Ranchers and farmers don’t like them and press for their removal, or even extinction, because they take the occasional calf or other young animal. On the other hand, maybe they like infestations of rabbits and other rodents.

    I am with Bron on feral hogs. It has been more than a half century ago, but seems like yesterday. I was treed by an old sow with a bunch of little pigs while squirrel hunting. My shotgun loaded with squirrel shot would have done nothing more than make her madder than she was already. I sat up in the tree until she got tired of trying to figure out where I went. I watched her and her litter leave, and made sure I went the opposite direction. A hog will kill you for sure. They are intelligent, and a lot faster than they look.

  20. The National Geo doc of which I spoke had a segment about Argentinian dogs imported to wild hog areas of Texas. They look like pit bull but have a different name. Hunting in groups, they bring down those bad boys like a cowboy ropin’ a calf.

  21. RB Those are VERY small numbers given the size of Montana, the 30 years time line, and this program has eliminated almost a third of that population in 2012 alone. Now I would be in favor of setting a target number of wolves to be sustained, and those numbers you offered ONLY were those reported killed. It does not include wolves which were shot as predators on livestock and out of season, and poaching. That is an extermination program given these other facts you wish to ignore.

  22. Nal, Thanks. I live in a big deer hunting state. It is a big industry. Bow season in under way and gun season is coming up soon. We now have too many deer thanks to policies geared to promote these industries. And, chronic wasting disease makes one suspect of eating venison. My concern for elk is not altruistic. I love eating elk and want them around for a nice wine reduction and Indian succotash.

  23. Nick S,

    I have no on the ground details of game management, here or out West.

    That link above,http://www.defendruralamerica.com/DRA/Wolves.html & it’s parent link has a great deal of on the ground info that is presented in more detail then other reports I’ve seen.

    Like because of the way the US govt currently manages the forest the forest fires do far more harm then an army of idiot hunters could ever do.

    I & others see it as a concerted effort to demonize the 2nd amd & to Remove the “Right” & that’s a documented fact that some polecats are out to do that.

    One thing I think you have knowledge of from the Prison Industrial Complex is the fact that even though there prisoners are not allowed guns they still find plenty of ways to kill & harm guards & other inmates.

    That’s important info that those wishing to get rid of the 2nd amd choose to ignore.

    Getting rid of legal law biding citizen’s “Rights” will not end violence it’ll only make it far worst!

    Caution as always, I’m not sure how much if any Neo Con/Corporate thieves influence has over that website I’m pumping.

    Like every group or organization if the evil b*stards find it helpful to them to corrupt it they will.

  24. Repeat for wordpress:

    Nick S,

    I have no on the ground details of game management, here or out West.

    That link above,defendruralamerica…./DRA/Wolve & it’s parent link has a great deal of on the ground info that is presented in more detail then other reports I’ve seen.

    Like because of the way the US govt currently manages the forest the forest fires do far more harm then an army of idiot hunters could ever do.

    I & others see it as a concerted effort to demonize the 2nd amd & to Remove the “Right” & that’s a documented fact that some polecats are out to do that.

    One thing I think you have knowledge of from the Prison Industrial Complex is the fact that even though there prisoners are not allowed guns they still find plenty of ways to kill & harm guards & other inmates.

    That’s important info that those wishing to get rid of the 2nd amd choose to ignore.

    Getting rid of legal law biding citizen’s “Rights” will not end violence it’ll only make it far worst!

    Caution as always, I’m not sure how much if any Neo Con/Corporate thieves influence has over that website I’m pumping.

    Like every group or organization if the evil bxxxstards find it helpful to them to corrupt it they will.

  25. 3rd attempt at posting:

    Nick S,

    I have no on the ground details of game management, here or out West.

    That link above, (skipped for wordpress) & it’s parent link has a great deal of on the ground info that is presented in more detail then other reports I’ve seen.

    Like because of the way the US govt currently manages the forest the forest fires do far more harm then an army of idiot hunters could ever do.

    I & others see it as a concerted effort to demonize the 2nd amd & to Remove the “Right” & that’s a documented fact that some polecats are out to do that.

    One thing I think you have knowledge of from the Prison Industrial Complex is the fact that even though there prisoners are not allowed guns they still find plenty of ways to harm guards & other inmates.

    That’s important info that those wishing to get rid of the 2nd amd choose to ignore.

    Getting rid of legal law biding citizen’s “Rights” will not end violence it’ll only make it far worst!

    Caution as always, I’m not sure how much if any Neo Con/Corporate thieves influence has over that website I’m pumping.

    Like every group or organization if the evil bass tards find it helpful to them to corrupt it they will.

  26. Only a government could sell 500 times more of something then it has available. The rest of us would be sitting in a jail cell, chatting with Bernard (Bernie) Lawrence Madoff.

  27. This is disgusting. ‘Conservationists’ ought to be able to take out licences on the hunters, make it a really interesting hunt. I kid you not.

  28. i’m gonna go up to montana and sell “not a wolf” signs to german shepards and siberian huskys.

    coyote’s will have to make their own.

  29. G0d damm it! WTF!! This is outrageous. BULLSHIT. I thought that the states were supposed to develop responsible management plans in order to be given rights to wolf management within their borders.

    Make no mistake, this is part of an overall orchestrated attack on clean water. Bear with me. Here’s my crazy, tin-foil hat theory: from wolf eradication out West, Tar Sands contamination up North, montaintop removal in the East, to fracking, well, everywhere, along with the weakening of the Clean Water act in the S. Ct., there is a serious reduction of clean water resources taking place on this continent. More of my tinsel headdress: the corptocracy has discovered that we’re willing to actually pay dearly for water, bottle and jug. Once they’ve reduced the amount of clean, treatable water to a trickle they’ve got us by the short and curlies. Game Over.

    OS was correct. The overwhelming majority of anmals taken by wolves are the sick, old, and feeble, the very animals hunters will not take. These unfit animals compete with the fit and healthy, reducing resources in the environment. All that is well established. The reduction is felt most acutely in riparian areas, where streambank vegetation is critcal for reducing siltation through erosion. Studies have shown that vegetation in riparian areas rebounded where wolves were reintroduced. (Citations to follow at a later date. I’m way too pi$$ed to look that shit up right now.)

    P.S. Brittius: relocating wolves has severely limited chances for success. Relocating them to areas where feral hogs are thriving is fraught with problems, such as the fact that wolc=ves range over greater territories than the hogs, and hogs are better at cohabiting with humans. Because so much of the life of the pack revolves around raising the litter of the alpha’s, spaynig and neutering would be like giving them a lobotomy.

    I voted for Obama; put an Obama sticker on my hardhat while I was working in the heart of redneck, blue-collar Wisconsin, studying for a degree in ecology. And when Obama brought in Salazar, I had misgivings; when they developed this horseshit plan, I knew – we got chumped. Everything that followed, Guantamino, pot arrests, drones, NSA spying, CIA pardons, Wall St. free passes – everything – was no surprise. at first, I thought Obama was simply naive by trying to shore up support in states that were never going to vote to reelect him. Now, I’m convinced that Big Corp is pulling the same number on us, with water, that Sherman and Sheridan pulled on Native Americans and the bufflao.

    I’m imploring, no, I’m begging readers here to contact the white house (I’ll wait for the laughter to die down). Ok, please contact the white house, the dept. of interior, Fish and Wilflife, and your elected officials. If you’re a lawyer and you feel up for a righteous fight, may I suggest you offer your services to the several groups who will no doubt be trying to halt this crap.

  30. https://www.facebook.com/theonlygoodwolfisadeadwolf

    If you read the comments on this facebook page, you’ll see the attitude of Montana / Idaho ranchers and elk hunters. Wolves are killing “their” elk and “their” livestock on “their” land, and therefore need to be “taught a lesson” often with the most painful and protracted death possible. Their motto is to “Smoke a pack a day” in reference to wiping out entire wolf populations.

  31. RTC

    pass the tinfoil

    i believe i read the same article on wolf reintroduction. i turns out by keeping the moose population in check it stabilized river banks. too many moose eating too many willows.

    i’ll see if i can find the article.

  32. I am here doing a study for the folks back home on planet Remulak. I am tasked to study two species: humanoids and ants. This hunting aspect of the humanoids is perplexing. Is there some innate thrill in killing some animal with a high powered rifle and the animal has no way to fight back? Please let me know your thoughts. But don’t believe that I am really from another planet. I am from France. But I do need some more information on this humanoid thing about killing wild animals. On Remulak we would call it a “Sport” if the two sides were evenly matched. That guy the other day who killed the elephant with the rifle did not explain his motivation very well either. Help me out here.

  33. Beldar: The consensus of the dogpac here is that male humans who are impotent or fear that they will be impotent, have this notion that if they blast an animal with a firearm that they will prove themselves worthy of their notion of manliness. That is why they like to tie the dead deer on the hood of the car and parade through town after the hunt by the Great White Hunter is over with. They seldom hide the dead body under a tarp in the back of a pickup.

  34. Yeah, these Great White Hunters are the same schmucks who will intentionally run over a turtle crossing the road with their vehicles.

  35. Beldar: Don’t you all eat snails in France? And what is it that ants and humans have in common that you would do a joint study of both species?

  36. I can’t speak to the wolf scheme, but the drama queen bit over African Big Game hunting of elephants is not only much ado about nothing, it’s misplaced.

    Regulated African big game hunting is the elephants best friend……With managed hunting fees of upwards of $50,000.00 per elephant tag, pay for Professional Hunters, guides, the local villages that harvest and eat the meat, lodging fees, a big game hunt can pump $100,000.00 per hunter can pump large cash into very poor communities that incentivize African Governmemts to hire rangers to fight the elephants real enemies, poachers and habitat loss……Keeping reserves that keep elephant populations healthy and culling responsible numbers.

    In other words, responsible hunters doors to protect elephants and other big game than all the whiny Disney outrage crowd.

  37. “Regulated African big game hunting is the elephants best friend……With managed hunting fees of upwards of $50,000.00 per elephant tag, pay for Professional Hunters, guides, the local villages that harvest and eat the meat, lodging fees, a big game hunt can pump $100,000.00 per hunter can pump large cash into very poor communities that incentivize African Governmemts to hire rangers to fight the elephants real enemies, poachers and habitat loss……Keeping reserves that keep elephant populations healthy and culling responsible numbers.

    In other words, responsible hunters doors to protect elephants and other big game than all the whiny Disney outrage crowd.”

    Mac,

    I’m not against hunting. However, I don’t personally care for the kind of conceited ass that would pay $50,000 to $100,000 to shoot an elephant in the face. All his/her “trophies” prove is that they have enough money to thoughtlessly kill a large animal to display their faux courage.

  38. Mike,
    The argument made by Mac reminds me of something I heard a long time ago. “We had to destroy the village to save it.”

  39. If we are to correct any problem we have to understand where the problem is, what it is & what are the options to address the problem.

    I’m not sure who the polecats in Montana are that came up with this crazy permit scheme, but their face on the scam cannot stand the light of day.

    Oath Keepers Founder, Stewart Rhodes & Pastor Chuck Baldwin both live in Montana I believe. One might contact them to see what the heck is going on.

    The video below is the last video of the series I posted yesterday.

    It’s about attempting to fix these many problems so I’m supportive.

  40. One might just totally depend on govt to do the correct things, but most of the time you’ll find yourselves disappointed.

    Or you could see what you can do with your & your friends actions to fix your concerns.

    So you wish to slow/stop animal abuse, you might watch this video & think about the animals that you bought prepackage at MickyD’s, WalMart, at the restaurant…

    My wife & I changed the way were living because about 15 years ago we started looking at these many issues seriously.

    Most all the food in our home today looks nothing like it did years back.

    We saved a bunch of money doing so & continue to reinvest the saving in long term capital projects. Yes, eat better & save doing so.

    What can you do?

  41. Oky1,
    We all need to do more. I won’t buy meat unless I know where it came from, which means I damn sure don’t frequent the meat counter at WallyWorld. We eat very little red meat. When we do get red meat, my daughter insists we eat farm raised bison because next to venison, it is the leanest red meat you can get and she worries about my cardiovascular system. We would have a little garden if it were not for the fact our entire yard used to be the river bed of a fast moving mountain stream a few eons ago. It is a solid mass of river rocks covered with a thin layer of topsoil. Simply setting out a rosebush is a major work project.

    Our next door neighbor cut down almost two dozen oak trees. There was absolutely nothing wrong with any of them. These were enormous trees, and when I checked the growth rings, they ranged from 160 years up to over 250 years old. I never did get an exact count on the older trees. When I got to about 250+ rings, I lost count and was not about to start over. He hated squirrels, birds, and leaves. Now his house sits in an island of bare grass and his heating bill went througth the roof. Good! :evil:

    Not too long after he cut down all those trees, the guy died. His obituary had a line, “He liked to mow his lawn.” OMFG!

    We lost a few trees to lighning and disease. I am replacing them with pecan trees and possibly some apple trees. Pecan trees are fast growning compared to hickory and other nut trees. That will attract critters and we will have more nuts and fruit than we can eat. We already have a really tall black walnut tree that makes a huge amout of nuts. It is a race with the squirrels as to who gets them first.

  42. OS,

    Nature is kinda cool sometimes.

    One day, I’m not sure why, but 5 or 6 crows picked a fight with a squirrel.

    They had him circled next to a (oak?) tree. One at a time they would rush him.

    He was sitting upright on his hind legs & as the crows attacked he would punch them. :)

    That went on about 15-20 minutes

  43. The 1st day of October Oklahoma law changed to were able bodied/of age people here getting food stamps have to work 20 hours a week.

    To the gen pop/biz owners, they cheer, good, make those lazy sobs work.

    It feels very short sighted to me.

    At the current wages if they can find a job for 20 hours the $9 or $10 an hour in pay isn’t enough to pay for the expenses of going to work.

    (car, tags, insurance, fuel, tires, etc..)

    Within the next few years the gen pop will reach 50% of them will be over 50.

    My concerns with the 2nd amd now is that those younger people are going to realize at some point the dead end that working low paying jobs are & 5-10%, ?, a certain percentage will turn to hardened criminals.

    My thinking is all those grandmas & granddads are going to need that 2nd amd for their own protection more then ever.

    I came from a very large family & so did my wife.

    At least 6 WW2 vets in the family. They all lived through the last (Was) the Great Depression.

    One family lived a couple of doors down from Pretty boy Floyd.

    A key point here is that I remember the tales of starvation back in the 30’s.

    Having trouble come up with the cash to even buy 22 shells for the rifle to hunt their supper with.

    So many people were hunting game for food that game soon became very hard to even find.

    At the same time the govt was destroying livestock in mass under the claim they were trying to reduce the supply to stabilize the price.

    The numbers I’m recalling for some reason is 10-30 million people staved in the US back then, 30’s era.

    And at the same time Wallst/Bush/Kennedy families were getting wealthy suppling cash/financing to build Hitler’s war machine.

    It’s a little different game this time, but it’s the same ole Wallst Bank/Insurance type that caused the trouble back then that are causing it this go around.

    The govt says it hasn’t the funds today for food stamps yet they’ve the money to attack Syria & even today are still suppling arms & training to Al Qaeda there. (Surface to air missiles, jeeze)

    More of the Gen Pop have far better info on where the real trouble is coming from this time.

    There are plenty of fairly decent people around, if they & their groups can come together & loosely organize themselves I believe we could turn many of these important issue around rather quickly.

  44. If you’re willing to stray just a bit out of the box, emu and ostrich are less than half the fat of bison, elk, etc. Then there’s rabbit, the incredibly cheap and plentiful lean meat, the leanest of all. And, tasty as hell.

  45. Nick,

    I started to get some Jack Rabbits last year for my mini farm, I get a kick out of the big floppy ears.

    A friend mine told me if I let them roam free they’d attack my garden so I back out of the plan.

    Maybe I build a large fenced area for some?

    OS,

    Even if one doesn’t have time or the place for a garden a great side benefit about thinking about how we organize our lives, where food comes from, etc., it means we can go out & meet local small farmers/gardeners & either trade or buy their quality products.

    One guy said in regards to “Chain Stores”, that we can break the Chains. :)

  46. OS,

    I know you’re interested in correcting the air pollution problem as am I.

    After reviewing that US Forestry guy, Steve Brink’s comments on the above video, I noticed about half way through he mentions that just in California, on average, forest fires cause 2.5 to 3 times as much 2.5 PM pollution then all the cars/trucks there.

    Prez Ike, I recall, subsidized local goat/sheep herders to graze on the under growth of the forest to prevent forest fires.

    Now we spend billions on firemen, firetrucks/copters.

    How much is wasted effort/capital, I’m not sure.

    As Steve Brink is thinking I also have long thought that if the govt allowed Lumbermen to go in & clear cut fire breaks in those forest so that if a fire does start it’s soon stopped at the fire break.

  47. pete 1, October 3, 2013 at 9:25 pm

    i’m gonna go up to montana and sell “not a wolf” signs to german shepards and siberian huskys.

    =========================
    You could get more money by selling to Dick Cheney’s hunting buddies.

  48. “Examine each question in terms of what is ethically and aesthetically right, as well as what is economically expedient. A thing is right when it tends to perserve the integrity, stability, and beauty of the biotic community. It is wrong when it tends otherwise.”

    *****

    “The last word in ignorance is the man who says of an animal or plant, ‘What good is it?’ If the land mechanism as a whole is good, then every part is good, whether we understand it or not. If the biota, in the course of aeons, has built something we like but do not understand, then who but a fool would discard seemingly useless parts? To keep every cog and wheel is the first precaution of intelligent tinkering.”

    *****

    “We reached the old wolf in time to watch a fierce green fire dying in her eyes. I realized then, and have known ever since, that there was something new to me in those eyes — something known only to her and to the mountain. I was young then, and full of trigger-itch; I thought that because fewer wolves meant more deer, that no wolves would mean hunters’ paradise. But after seeing the green fire die, I sensed that neither the wolf nor the mountain agreed with such a view.

    Since then I have lived to see state after state extirpate its wolves. I have watched the face of many a newly wolfless mountain, and seen the south-facing slopes wrinkle with a maze of new deer trails. I have seen every edible bush and seedling browsed, first to anemic desuetude, and then to death. I have seen every edible tree defoliated to the height of a saddlehorn. Such a mountain looks as if someone had given God a new pruning shears, and forbidden Him all other exercise. … I now suspect that just as a deer herd lives in mortal fear of its wolves, so does a mountain live in mortal fear of its deer.”

    ― Three quotes from the writings of Aldo Leopold

  49. The message is in the median (of the road) where the dead wolves are sometimes found. The great white hunters don’t parade the dead wolves around town on the hood of the car like they do the dead deer. The State of Montana wants wolves to be extinct. Period. It is a Pirate Territory. Fly over and flush.

  50. @Brittius I hate to use this line, but nothing else is fitting. You’re one special kind of stupid, aren’t you? Spay and neuter an animal that SHOULD still be on the endangered species list? We don’t need to thin the wolf population, we need to thin our own so that wolves and other animals can actually live the way nature intended them to without humans feeling so inconvenienced by simple nature. Less than 1000 wolves vs. the millions of people in the state? Yeah, I don’t think we have to worry about the wolves actually being a problem. The human race needs to get the hell over itself already and learn to live WITH nature instead of destroying it at every turn.

  51. […] Montana Issues 6000 Permits To Kill Up To 30,000 Wolves . . . For A … . elephant in the face and then celebrating with champagne. Given the outcry over the show, he may want to check out Montana where hunters can make a real killing with a $19 license to kill up to five wolves. That is… 6000 permits which would allow the killing of 30,000 wolves. The entire wolf population however is down to 625 in the entire state. These wolves are impressive as hell in person. Me, a full grown man wouldn't stand a chance against just one of  […]

  52. People, this is a lie. I have Montana’s wolf regulations and you can receive one tag at a time and can purchase up to five tags. Each tag is good for only one wolf and you must wait for 24 hours before purchasing a new tag after use of the first. Wolves are difficult to hunt and the likelihood of getting one, let alone 5, is extremely low. It’s about time Montana does something to control wolf population that’s killing off all the elk, moose, and deer.

  53. Dan what you say is a lie. I never heard of there being no elk, moose or deer being extinct in Montana before white men arrived on the scene and made the WOLF extinct. So to say that having 600+ wolves killing off all those other species is patently absurd. Now I am sure that wolf predation has cut down on the numbers of those species, but that is called normal and makes them wary and harder to see and to hunt. Thus the lesser numbers for easy pickings by hunters. Sorry to hear that hunters in Montana will now have to do more than go out a short distance from their cabins and actually have to HUNT those game animals, instead of rolling out of bed and shooting them from close proximity to camp. Shoot, it makes them actually have to HUNT! How unfair!

  54. When the wolves live in “YOUR Backyard” then you can decide what happens to them.. As far as I’m concerned, I do not believe in extinction, but in some areas here in Montana, they are a problem, One Rancher out her lost 27 head of calves in one season to wolves, and was not compensated for it, this is a fact.

  55. Mandy, I agree that wolves do like easier prey than wild game. Of course, there is a solution to this that has been used over the centuries. They are called shepherds. It is not the business of the government to subsidize ranchers costs by killing off all the predators. You go swimming in the ocean, you know that there are SHARKS in that water. It is not necessary for the government to kill off most of the sharks so that we can all be safe.

    The FACT is that the state and Federal government DID make the wolves extinct, AND they were proud of it too. So to say you are not in favor of extinction rings VERY hollow to say the least. I have dogs and if I see a wolf attacking one, I will kill it. I have no problem with ranchers doing similar things to protect their livestock. This is NOT what is being done.

  56. Are you Daft?? Montana did not issue 6,000 tags to kill up to 30,000 wolves. It makes me scratch my head where you even get your information.

    P.S. there are way more than 625 wolves in Montana too…..

  57. you are dumb asses, sure they have 30000 possible tags, you don’t think they have a quota when they hit the number “WE” need thinned out. They clearly will not let us kill every wolf in Montana, though it wouldn’t bother me. between the 20 percent drop in elk populations, and the lack of a management to keep 15 breeding pairs it was the tree huggers like you that caused this over population. You probably think Montana is in Canada too ba haha. And just so you know only 400 were killed, and with the amount of breeding pairs, 200 more will be made this year. putting our population roughly 200 less than what it was.

  58. If you think that the numbers of wolves are way off, then just what makes you think the number of elk are accurate? At least you are honest in admitting you want to kill off ALL the wolves. So it is the ignorant so called “hunters” like YOU that give us all a bad name. I have gone hunting a number of times and have come up with no game. That is part of hunting! It is not up to the state to artificially run up the numbers so that you can just get a shot after rolling out of bed with a bad hangover and not going too far to bag your limit.

    You want more elk? Then breed them in captivity, release them in the wild. They will be used to humans then, and will not be so hard to hunt too. A win-win for all. It is not our job to subsidize your kind of “hunting” by killing off most of the wolves.

    I am also damned tired of subsidizing ranchers who are too damn cheap to hire the best anti-predation measure that has worked for thousands of years. They are called SHEPHERDS. It is NOT our job to cater to your laziness and cheapskates.

  59. I am a hunter i like to hunt and i think that the wolves need to be killed to manage the the deer population and i don’t care if it has a family i am no bunny hugger

  60. I say let the northwestern states take care of thier own and let the liberal piles of crap go back east and bitch about what they have no idea what they are talking about(randyjet!). I’ve lived and hunted Montana my whole life, and anyone who says the elk population hasn’t been dramaticlly affected since the wolves arrived to the area is a flat out liar. These arent even the kind of wolves we had to begin with. These are Canadian timber wolves not the small prarie wolves that were once native to this area. These wolves are much larger and much more aggressive, with evidence that they are killing for the joy of it and not just for feeding. So to all you bleeding heart liberal dicks, I say WELCOME TO MONTANA…NOW GET THE HELL OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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