A new Rasmussen poll reveals that 58% of people polled would like to see Flight 253 bombing suspect Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab tortured for information. It is not just an indictment of our values but another byproduct of President Obama’s blocking of any independent investigation and prosecution of torture under the Bush Administration. By protecting Bush officials, Obama is reinforcing their argument that such measures are merely controversial and not crimes.
The poll asked individuals: “Should waterboarding and other aggressive interrogation techniques be used to gain information from the suspected bomber?” The result was 58% yes, to only 30% who said no. I was asked the same question during this segment of The Situation Room.
What is astonishing is that this poll occurred virtually as people were leaving for churches and synagogues to celebrate the holidays. I guess that walking on water thing was just a prelude to waterboarding the Pharisees.
For the full story, click here.
AY,
Agreed.
Now back to torture.
Buddha,
I think if swartzmore mom is happy with the result, then I should be to. I don’t want to be accused of being a Pro Totalitarian. I certainly have enough to deal with.
The problem with personal attacks and some folks, is when the attacks start you never know where they are going to end. I think its best if they get cut off quick and recognize them for what they are as subtle as they can be.
Who knows they may be tied to the cycle of the moon. I certainly don’t.
Cheney is out advocating torure and the republican party is following him. Thinking that it is okay to torture has become commonplace after the Bush Cheney years. It is tragic. I think this poll is probably accurate.
ThirtyPercenter–
I don’t think it’s apathy. I think we’re becoming a country that is losing its soul.
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Excerpts from the post at the Rasmussen site regarding the poll taken on December 30th of 1,000 Likely Voters:
“Men and younger voters are more strongly supportive of the aggressive interrogation techniques than women and those who are older. Republicans and voters not affiliated with either major party favor their use more than Democrats.
“Seventy-one percent (71%) of all voters think the attempt by the Nigerian Muslim to blow up the airliner as it landed in Detroit should be investigated by military authorities as a terrorist act. Only 22% say it should be handled by civilian authorities as a criminal act, as is currently the case.”
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“All these findings are explained in part by the belief of 43% that when it comes to national security the U.S. legal system worries too much about protecting individual rights. That’s up four points from November.”
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I wonder if this poll of 1,000 likely voters is truly indicative of what Americans think. I certainly hope it isn’t.
In a blog post about 58 percent of Americans saying they’d like to see this messed up kid tortured it looks like no ones even interested. Everyone is ranting about personal attacks and other random chatter rather than discussing this serious loss of common morality in our country.
Could the greatest threat to our liberty and humanity ultimately prove to be our own apathy?
I wish to make a small point as it refers to the League of Women Voters. I might have led others to think that the League takes sides on candidates because while discussing candidates on this thread I mentioned my League experience. The League only supports/endorses issues after careful and in-depth study. The League never supports or opposes candidates. That is why we are able to offer neutral ground for “Candidates Night” in communities across the nation. The League of Women Voters encourages the informed and active participation of citizens in government.
If I erred in a turn of phrase, I hope this corrects any misleading impressions I may have given.
AY,
I’ve been thinking about your issue in re Jill vs. Smom.
1) Yes. I know that when cornered Jill is either incapable or unwilling to make a proper apology. Her motions to me were facile at best, but I let it go as everyone here but her (and Mike S. pointed this out) knows I treat both sexes equally. That means both the good AND the bad. That means humor. That means criticism. That means warfare if merited. That means love and compassion if merited. My defense was complete. Her actual apology would have been gravy, but I’ll take what I got. It’s that turning the other cheek thing Jesus was so big on.
3) I was not offended by her actions in half-heartedness. I accept some people cannot apologize well or at all. That is their failing as a human and no one else’s.
4) While I too have defended Jill from personal attacks from that person who is no longer here, Jill’s personal attacks on me without an express apology do have a consequence. If she gets jumped on again by ad hominem attacks? From anyone?
I won’t defend her again since she used that tactic on me and wouldn’t own it. She acted with dishonor. Plain and simple.
I’ll not defend her again. Well, obviously I’d defend her if she was in actual physical danger, that’s humane and I do not dislike her. But in the war of words? She committed a technical foul against her own team on more than one occasion now and without adequate remediation. See Slartibartfast’s posts of remediation on the WTC thread for good examples of recovery from a misstep. He’s good. Am I mad at Jill? No. Disappointed, yes, but in no way upset.
5) Swarthmore mom. I have to agree. She is owed an apology. That she does not require one says a lot about her character. If AY tells me you have vast life experience? He and I have talked on the phone quite a bit. Traded some hairy stories. His word on this issue is gold. But your response to this situation would have confirmed that even if I took AY’s word with a bit o’ salt. You turn you cheeks well and strike a good profile while doing so.
6) If Smom is satisfied and I’m satisfied (Mike hasn’t weighed in yet)? Let it go unless Jill decides to go ad hominem again. She not a frequent offender. Might I suggest you just do as I will do. Next time she lights into someone or someone lights into her, just stand back and let the chips fall where they will. Jill is not respecting the dojo on argument technique. There is no shame in apology but there is shame in not owning your actions. There are consequences for being half-assed about it. Consequences like she can flounder on her own when the next Patty shows up and starts savagely beating her over the head (an apt description of what was happening too). Those were some serious fighting words and had they been in the same space, my bouncer instinct would have had me separate them physically.
It’s time next time for some tough love. Jill wants to use the weapon? She needs to learn that misusing it has a price. Next time there is a “mishap”? We should just form a ring and let her and her opponent go at it. She’ll either a) learn to apologize properly, b) learn how to use the attack properly or c) learn not to use the attack if it’s beyond her skill or control.
Hume is not only wrong, he’s a proven clown at this point.
Buddhism is indeed not only compatible with recovery, it’s more likely to develop sustained recovery as there will be no reliance on a “higher power” other than Tiger’s own determination and acceptance of his flaws so that he may outgrow them. Self determination is always a better cure than fear or abdicating self-control to a “higher power” although that works just fine for some. I’m big on owning your mistakes and taking control of your life. Accepting what you cannot control does not require a higher power for all – just self awareness and control over the ONLY thing ANYONE has actual control over – themselves. Tiger must appeal to the buddha nature within to find peace. No divine intervention required and the end result is the same – except if he fails, he cannot blame God for abandoning him. It’ll be his own fault. Just like the situation he’s in now for not being able to keep his tiger cub in his pants. But Brit is moron if he thinks Jesus is requisite for sobriety. Pure theocratic horseshit that. Yeah, Brit! Jesus may be the only path to heaven in some people’s sick and distorted readings of the Bible, but I guarantee he’s not required to clean up. The desire to clean up is what is required to clean up. The paths to that end are many.
Brit Hume. You were once a journalist, sock puppet. How much of Rupert’s money did it take for you to become a propaganda whore?
Swartsmore mom,
I was pondering the issue and I am offended that Jill has not offered you an apology. I see that she has been trying to ingratiate herself with others on this list today. For one that wants accountability for others they have no problem ignoring their own short comings. The word Hypocrite comes to mind.
Brit Hume is totally wrong. Buddhism is very compatible with recovery.
The following is off topic–but I had to share this video of Brit Hume telling how he thinks Tiger Woods can be redeemed on FOX News.
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVjuO5v5Cts&hl=en_US&fs=1&]
Swarthmore mom,
AY I do not want an apology from Jill. I had become uppity in her mind and deserved a smackdown. Also Henry Waxman is an influential liberal who is very safe in his Beverly Hills district.I really do not know if it is a year for the I’s. I think they would need to get their campaigns together sometime soon. It is 2010.
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I do not care what she says so long as she does not make it personal. If you will recall, we once had a contributing member on here that blew this Blawg to smithereens. I wished that it did not get out of hand this time and felt the need to defend you honor.
Call it being a sexists or what have you, I call it being a friend. I am a lot of things and I am guilty of a lot of thoughts but what I do with those thoughts is what I am responsible for.
I do not like Bigots or Sexists. Which I think she is and try’s and cover in her writings. But then again, people see what they want to in another’s writings.
I do not care to read Steinbeck, Faulkner or Hemmingway. However the messages that they convey could never be the same for everyone as they write in abstracts to me. There is just one more thing to ponder each time I read something that they have written.
However there are much more educated people than I. I can still learn to learn.
Ms. EM’
Very good, biting, and accurate M. Bachmann poem…although I am a strong proponent of the 2nd Amendment.
Michele Bachmann is the worst. A good democrat Taryl Clark is running against her.
First to go?
Sen. Mitch “I’m A Fascist Obstructionist Tool” McConnell (R) if we can staple him to Rep. Nancy “No Spine” Pelosi (D).
But really, as long as we keep Kucinich? The rest of them can all go in the bin as earned by their performances over the last two years. Not a plug nickel’s worth of difference in the rest of the graft swilling pigs.
Byron–
Michele Bachmann also makes my Top Ten List. I think the woman is NUTS!!!
Remember when she said she wanted residents of her state “armed and dangerous?”
From Huffington Press, March 23, 2009
Michele Bachmann: I Want People “Armed And Dangerous” Over Obama Tax Plan
Excerpt:
Controversial Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) said this weekend that she wants residents of her state “armed and dangerous” over President Barack Obama’s plan to reduce global warming “because we need to fight back.”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/03/23/michele-bachmann-i-want-p_n_178156.html
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Here’s a poem I wrote about Bachmann back in March.
Michele Bachmann: Armed and Dangerous
She’s wild-eyed and packin’ heat—
One congressgal who’s not so sweet.
She isn’t your typical Minnesotan.
She’s militant…warlike—and totin’
A derringer in her Gucci bag…
A Smith and Wesson—40 mag,
A semi-automatic Colt.
She thinks it’s time for an armed revolt.
She’s out inciting insurrection!
(How DID this crank win re-election?????)
She says she’s ready for a revolution!
I say she’s ready for an institution—
An asylum for the politically inane
With padded cells. This gal’s insane.
She’s crazy. She’s possessed. She’s mad!
As a final thought I’d like to add:
She needs a good psychiatrist—
Or, better still, an exorcist!
AY I do not want an apology from Jill. I had become uppity in her mind and deserved a smackdown. Also Henry Waxman is an influential liberal who is very safe in his Beverly Hills district.I really do not know if it is a year for the I’s. I think they would need to get their campaigns together sometime soon. It is 2010.
Byron–
Who do I like for first off the ship? Boy! That’s a hard one. There are so many to choose from. And every day, there’s another political figure I’d like to send to the hall of shame. It’s hard keeping track of them all. Dick Armey would have been in my top ten–along with DeLay. I’ll have to think about this one. Joe Lieberman is definitely in contention.
I’m glad people are on their soap boxes here! Keep it up!
Another thought on this Rasmussen poll: At least FOX is getting better at math. The numbers didn’t add up to 120% this time.