Creepier Than Thou: Questions Raised About Koran Burning Church

The Dove World Outreach Center (DWOC), headed by Rev. Terry Jones has already triggered violence internationally with its promise this weekend to burn copies of the Koran (Qu’ran) and prompted our military commander in Iraq to speak out that such a hateful act would put the lives of U.S. soldiers in jeopardy. Jones, however, is unmoved and is willing to sacrifice someone’s son or daughter for his publicity stunt. Now, we are learning how really creepy this group is.

The 50-family Gainesville church is headed by Jones and his wife Sylvia. Its “Academy Rulebook” was written in November 2007 by Sylvia Jones. The rulebook restricts every part of the lives of students including cutting off contact with family members. They warn “[f]amily occasions like wedding, funerals or Birthdays are no exception to this rule . . . No phone calls. Exceptions can be made under certain circumstances but only after receiving permission.” Romantic relationships are barred: “there is no need to talk at all, or even flirt!” Students must be weighed repeatedly and are barred from “eating out in restaurants.” Students are told to “wash or shower at least once a day but not more then 2 a day,” and to be sure to cleanse “Mouth, sweat areas, hair, feet hands.”

For members have accused the Jones’ of abuse and using church funds for personal purposes. They appear to be in the furniture selling business, though allegations have been raised about the use of the church for this purpose (here).

Jones, 58, is the author of “Islam Is of the Devil” and models much of his lectures on the movie “Braveheart.”

Source: here.

176 thoughts on “Creepier Than Thou: Questions Raised About Koran Burning Church”

  1. Slartibartfast,

    I think your plan should work. The *good* comments throughout the web on both sides of the WTC issue are interesting; however, some of us are just not interested in reading them here.

    You owe neither me nor anyone else an apology.


  2. FFLEO,

    In the future I’ll keep my responses on the subject of 9/11 on the threads that have already been irrevocably hijacked. If Bob continues with his attempt to add stalking to his resume (along with intellectual dishonesty, hypocrisy, and profound misunderstandings about basic physics) by following me around the blog, I will post my responses on a 9/11 thread and link to it like I did with my reply to Byron.

    I apologize for using your entirely reasonable and polite request as an opportunity to take a shot at Bob, but seeing as how this is clearly personal with him and he is apparently unwilling to drop it, I’m not going to restrain myself from making legitimate attacks when he continues to invite them.

  3. lottakatz,

    We have been to the hospital only 5 times this year so you, sadly, have the lead. He is a strong willed man and fights the good fight.

    You and he have a great deal in common when it comes to the decision about 2012. He has been a life long democrat and his disappointment in Obama is almost palatable. He was a strong guy for Hillary but enthusiastically voted for Obama and believed change was really coming. I believe he feels more betrayed than he ever felt before and that’s going some since he supported Johnson over Goldwater figuring he would end the war in Nam. That, of course, was a huge betrayal so feeling worse about Obama is pretty big.

  4. Blouise, Thanks for your kindness. I’m sorry to hear that you have reason for empathy, it’s a constant stressor and takes it’s toll and I’m sorry you have cause to understand. I hope the good days are outnumbering the the bad days for your better half, mine, not so much. Spent the night in the emergency room, the 8th time this year. The hospital needs to keep him ’till they fix him or kill him but hospitals and medicine-in-general doesn’t work that way. Medicine driven by private insurance is the scourge of our society. If your lucky enough to have insurance.

    Uh, oh…. rant mode Auto-On….

    I voted for President Obama for 3 reasons: He was the smart one, he would wind down and end the wars which are bleeding our country and strangling the economy/progress, and he would bust the trust as it applied to insurance industry which, as everyone knows, is killing people by omission daily. The Democratic Party platform said ‘public option’ which is short of single payer which I wanted but competition is a good first step, I’d live with it. Not because I’d use it if it didn’t provide adequate coverage (which my insurance doesn’t really anymore) but because it would stop the frivolous murder of sick people which our current system of insurance for profit mandates.

    That didn’t happen. Hell, even DADT is still in place. (Can we, like, have universal civil rights? We’re trying to have a society here after all.) I’m pissed, stay pissed, and carry grudges. That he’s the smart one doesn’t earn my vote for 2012 for any politician and that’s even without the better half being ill. That just makes it a little more personal but being personal is not dispositive regarding my vote and never has been. Enlightened self-interest dictates that voting not be personal and I have striven for 30+ to vote based on enlightened self-interest. I have been reassessing my theory of voting over the last year and I’m not sure where it will take me, probably to a foolish place 🙂 but I’m very unhappy with where our country is and where it’s heading and I better get my butt in gear because the mid-terms are here and I’ve got some voting to do.

    Rant mode OFF.

  5. Bob, Esq.,

    You must know that you lose credibility when you reply to a lengthy post of Slartibartfast’s with a base, nonsensical ad hominem retort.

    I say this as a man who likes your comments regarding the legal issues that abound within this blawg; however, your opinions on the World Trade Center are just that and they are not backed by the requisite credentials that lend credence to what you opine. I accept that you say you have a J.D. and therefore I give your comments more weight regarding legal issues than I would from others without those credentials, including Slartibartfast.

    I prefer not to read about the WTC theories within a legal blawg unless they are posited by Professor Turley and I could go to *many* other blogs or websites to read the opinions of credentialed engineers, if I wanted. However, I do not want to and I have a hard time avoiding the issue when you pursue Slartibartfast around within several threads within this blawg inciting him to engage with you on the subject.

    Therefore, please take this *request* in the vein of friendship that it is intended and post the WTC comments on the other thread(s)—as Slartibartfast suggested—that are already replete with such comments.

    Thanks. I will not quibble with your decision if you disagree with my *request*.

  6. Buckeye: 1, “I see intimidation when the FBI visits someone that has broken a Federal law and hasn’t declared plans to do so; a person causing the government great consternation by exercising his right.”

    I am totally sorry about that. It should have been “hasn’t”.

    I see today that Rev. Wacko has reconsidered. Perhaps the FBI told him (during their non-intimidating, just social visit) what really happened to the DC madame, or promised him a bunk in the same cell with Don Siegalman. Last I read the good (and crazy) Rev. has said he would NEVER burn a qur’an. LOL. Srsly, one hopes his painfully long “15 minutes’ is up.

    This is a troubling situation though. I read that a planned bible burning by a Muslim person was stopped by court order in South Africa. We have read on this blawg several examples of speech against religions being enjoined or punished as hate speech and this blawg only hits the high points, it happens frequently and laws against such speech are proliferating.

    These things are an intellectual devolution and they are becoming commonplace in our own country even though they are forbidden by the Constitution. Religion is damaging our science, medicine, discourse, politics and law. We are devolving as a nation to some sort of mediaeval analogue. We are having out culture hijacked by the most radical aspects of a deluded, pre-intellectual minority who want to supplant our form of government with a theocracy and who pine for the great conflagration. A death cult is fighting the great enlightenment and winning, with the help of the corporatocracy and its political enablers.

    We are becoming the old Soviet Union at best and the new 1400’s at the worst. I’m just entirely pissed off and amazed by it. What’s more, If you look at the tenets of christian extremism and muslim extremism there’s not a nickels’ worth of difference between them, except for their enemies list. A plague on all their houses.

    Rant, rant, rant 🙂

  7. Slarti:

    Cardboard is analog to steel? Their modulus of elasticity is nowhere near the same. And cardboard isn’t ductile, at least as far as I know.

    You might be on to something though-high modulus ductile cardboard. We could build the new WTC with it. 🙂

  8. Byron,

    Newt for President in 2012????? Just the kind of upstanding man we want leading our country!

    Gingrich Family Values: Stick a Fork in Newt
    By Andy Ostroy
    Posted: August 13, 2010 10:01 AM

    If Newt Gingrich expects to run for president in 2012, let alone win, he better think again. Seems his ex-wife Marianne has a little score to settle, and has gone public in a scathing magazine interview about her former hubby’s kinky past, especially as it relates to marriage. Thanks to Mrs. #2, we’ve now confirmed what most of us have known all along: that when it comes to family-values, Gingrich, like most Republicans, believes there’s two sets…one for him and one for everyone else.

    So what’s in Newt’s closet? Well, Marianne unloaded her bombshells in ESQUIRE’s September profile of the former House Speaker. Here’s some of the juiciest revelations:

    • That he met his first wife Jackie when she was his high-school geometry teacher. They married when he was 19 and she 26.

    • He later dumped Jackie, while she was recovering from cancer, to marry then-mistress Marianne.

    • He later dumped Marianne, for mistress and eventual third wife Callista, while she suffered from Multiple Sclerosis (apparently Newt has huge issues with the marital vow “in sickness and in health”). While married to Marianne, Newt wanted her to “tolerate” his affair with Callista, who is 23 years his junior.

    • In answering an incredulous Marianne who questioned his hypocritical public family-values grandstanding while cheating on her with his much younger aide Callista, Gingrich arrogantly replied: “It doesn’t matter what I do. People need to hear what I have to say. There’s no one else who can say what I say. It doesn’t matter what I live.” Talk about delusions of grandeur.

    As Stephen Colbert noted about Gingrich Wednesday night, “He’s so morally upright he’s only had sex after he was married, just not always to the woman he was married to.”


    Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich Acknowledges Having Affair During Clinton Impeachment
    Thursday, March 08, 2007,2933,258001,00.html

    Gingrich has said he is waiting to see how the Republican field shapes up before deciding in the fall whether to run.
    Reports of extramarital affairs have dogged him for years as a result of two messy divorces, but he has refused to discuss them publicly.

    Gingrich, who frequently campaigned on family values issues, divorced his second wife, Marianne, in 2000 after his attorneys acknowledged Gingrich’s relationship with his current wife, Callista Bisek, a former congressional aide more than 20 years younger than he is.

    His first marriage, to his former high school geometry teacher, Jackie Battley, ended in divorce in 1981. Although Gingrich has said he doesn’t remember it, Battley has said Gingrich discussed divorce terms with her while she was recuperating in the hospital from cancer surgery.

    Gingrich married Marianne months after the divorce.

    “There were times when I was praying and when I felt I was doing things that were wrong. But I was still doing them,” he said in the interview. “I look back on those as periods of weakness and periods that I’m … not proud of.”

    Gingrich’s congressional career ended in 1998 when he abruptly resigned from Congress after poor showings from Republicans in elections and after being reprimanded by the House ethics panel over charges that he used tax-exempt funding to advance his political goals.

  9. W=^..^,

    That’s 60 aerospace engineers (and over 1,000 total engineers and architects) that are willing to lend their name to an organization run by a moron who believes that cardboard is a structural analog for the building materials of the twin towers, who asks where the evidence of pancaked floors is while showing pictures of pancaked floors elsewhere in his presentations, and who doesn’t understand the concept of static load vs. dynamic load (I’d include more idiocy from A&E for 9/11 Truth, but I can only use two links). The nicest thing I can say about these people is that many of the members have probably been duped by A&E for 9/11 Truth’s propaganda to believe lies that are outside of their area of expertise.


    Yeah, I’m not sure why Bob wants to continually associate himself with the 9/11 argument in which he’s repeatedly exhibited intellectual dishonesty, hypocrisy, and ignorance. Maybe this is his way of trying to change the venue to a thread where people put more credence in unsupported allegations and misunderstanding of physics than they do in rational, science-based arguments with references…

  10. Elaine:

    Newt told her he was leaving his wife and took advantage of her?
    Well at least Newt married her and didn’t string her along. 🙂

    She has a weird nose and I don’t find her attractive, to stiff and hard for a woman. She probably whips Newt pre and post copulation.

    I like to call her a “praying” Mantis. 🙂

  11. It is my understanding and maybe its correct or maybe it isn’t but LBJ settled political battles by the use of the FBI and IRS. Apparently Spiro resigned not because he was a bad golfer and hit a reporter in the head, but because he indicted and maybe convicted of Income Tax Evasion.

    I think it ironic Willie was investigated during GeoI reign after he admitted that he smoked weed on top of the Whitehouse with a Secret Service Agent during the Carter Administration……

    Yes, we are from the government and we are indeed here to help….

  12. “We usually tend to make our own problems.” (Buckeye) … without any idea how to solve them.

  13. James M.

    Thank you. That does make sense. I was rushed today and didn’t take time to figure it out.

    I am inclined to think the FBI had some information about threats to the pastor and wanted him to know about it. Obviously they can’t stop him unless they have someone arrest him. And since everyone from the President on down has already said he is free to make the choice to burn or not to burn I don’t know what charge could be used.

    I haven’t been watching the news today, so don’t know if the burning took place or not, and don’t much care since any damage has already been done and there are people coming out of the woodwork willing to do the same, anyway.

    As far as FBI intimidation, I think a lot would depend on your response to the interviewers/investigators. If you have a chip on your shoulder, it usually goes downhill fast whether you are interacting with a salesperson, a neighbor, a cop, or a government agent. We usually tend to make our own problems.

  14. Byron,

    If she’s such a “God faring Christian woman,” why did she have an affair with a married man?

    When Newtie gets senile–she’ll be telling him: “Honey, just sign here…right on the dotted line.


  15. FFLEO/Elaine:

    she is a God faring Christian woman, odds are good she will change her little Newtie’s diapers or at least hire it done. 🙂

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