We have another preacher who is holding forth on homosexuality with some pretty shocking rhetoric. Dennis Leatherman of the Mountain Lake Independent Baptist Church in Oakland, Maryland can claim to be more merciful because, while he says that he positively aches to kill gays “in a fleshy way,” he cannot actually kill because of the Bible. That means that he cannot build the death camps of Rev. Worley — as much as he might want to.
During a 50-minute sermon entitled, “Homosexuality and the Bible,” Letherman is quoted as saying
“To be . . . have a tendency to be effeminate or homosexual is just as wicked as to have a tendency to be a womanizer . . . Sinful nature does not justify sinful behavior. Now what is our take? What is our response? . . . First of all, there is a danger of reacting in the flesh, of responding not in a scriptural, spiritual way, but in a fleshly way. Kill them all. Right? I will be very honest with you. My flesh kind of likes that idea. But it grieves the Holy Spirit. It violates Scripture. It is wrong. Number one, I put this down. How do we respond? We need to hold true to God’s Word. As despicable as it is to our thinking, we must not compromise. […]
The lies of the sodomite, same sex marriage promoters are going largely unchallenged in our society. It is a storm rolling across this country that is absolutely tearing everything up in its path and there are few of any, particularly in public positions who are standing up and saying, ‘This is wrong.’”
It is sad that in some quarters that passes for moral correctness. The disappointment in having to adhere to the limits of the Bible is palpable and painful. Just as you have a righteous desire to murder, the Bible steps in and tells you to let gays and lesbians live.
The Church has responded to the controversy with a curious distinction:
In a recent 50 minute message on homosexuality, Pastor Leatherman made a 5 second reference to his “flesh.” The term “flesh” in the Bible simply refers to our fallen, sinful nature. It is through the “new birth” of trusting Jesus Christ as Saviour that our nature is changed (2 Corinthians 5:17, Galatians 5:19-24). Here is the full quote in question:
“First of all, there is a danger of reacting in the flesh, of responding not in a scriptural, spiritual way, but in a fleshly way. ‘Kill them all. Right?’ I will be very honest with you. My flesh kind of likes that idea. But it grieves the Holy Spirit. It violates Scripture. It is wrong.”
You cannot get any clearer, “it is wrong” to respond to homosexuality in any other way than a scriptural, spiritually mature and firmly compassionate way. Perhaps rewording the statement to say, “THE flesh” as opposed to “MY flesh” would more accurately express the meaning, but to suggest that Pastor Leatherman or the church advocates violence of any type toward homosexuals is to completely misconstrue what his message was saying.
I am unsure how the use of a definite article materially changes the meaning: ‘Kill them all. Right?’ I will be very honest with you. THE flesh kind of likes that idea. But it grieves the Holy Spirit.” Much better.
Source: Yahoo
Most Homophobes are Gay
Research by US psychologist Prof. Adams of the University of Georgia suggests that 80 percent of men who are homophobic have secret homosexual feelings.
In Prof. Adams’s test, homophobic men who said they were exclusively heterosexual were shown gay sex videos. Four out of five became sexually aroused by the homoerotic imagery, as recorded by a penile circumference measuring device (a plethysmograph).
Prof. Adams’s research was published in the prestigious US Journal of Abnormal Psychology in 1996, with the backing of the American Psychological Association.
Prof. Adams says his research shows that most homophobes “demonstrate significant sexual arousal to homosexual erotic stimuli”, suggesting that homophobia is a form of “latent homosexuality where persons are either unaware of or deny their homosexual urges”.
These findings support the theories that homophobia (fear and hatred of gayness and support for antigay discrimination) is often indicative of repressed, self-loathing homosexual feelings; and that many homophobes subconsciously use anti-gay attitudes as a smokescreen to disguise their own homosexuality.
pete:
“him and larry craig in one mens room would sound like a tap dancing contest between sammy davis jr and fred astaire.”
*********************
I nominate you for comment of the day, Here a little video of a church meeting:
Dog save us from phony xmas.
The bible isn’t the word of God. What is God? By whose definition? The bible was written by men purporting to represent God. Want to talk about propaganda? How about mythology.
God save us from phoney “Christians”.
“To abide even as I means Jesus did not have sex.” (artiewhitefox)
Or he meant don’t bother with marriage and just have a lot of sex.
him and larry craig in one mens room would sound like a tap dancing contest between sammy davis jr and fred astaire.
Importanttopics, The first part of the pastor’s statement is as you claim, it’s the last paragraph quoted that could be interpreted as a call to arms. I’d not trust the mush-brained followers of an Evangelical preacher (any preacher that borrows heavily from the Old Testament) to grasp the subtlety of the transition or place the emphasis on the proper part of the statement.
Better know your bible KJV before you open your mouth.<>
King James Version 8; I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.
To abide even as I means Jesus did not have sex.
AY, I thought that was John the Baptist.
Jesus couldn’t marry because he fell under the ban of “Mumzerut,” but he could have (and it appears quite probable that he did have) sex with women, particularly among his followers.
Have you heard about the dyslexic, agnostic, insomniac?
He stayed up all night worrying about the existence of a DOG!
Better know your bible KJV before you open your mouth. 8I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.
To abide even as I means Jesus did not have sex.
I was getting ready to say that this fat pig is just another Nazi employing his religion to justify his lust for murder when I got to the bottom of the comments and saw Ken’s comment above. Right on Ken.
Dogs in our dog pack do not give a second thought to notions of gay or straight. We hump legs for Christ sake. And, sometimes not for Christ’s sake. We dogs know it all when it comes to religion. Remember what God spelled backwards is. On the Eighth Day God created himself in his own image….
Just another fascist using religion to justify murder.
We are flesh, and blood.The devil is in the religious preacher willingly believing a lie thinking that murder is A OK salivating for flesh, and blood. The true spirit in religions is becoming more, and more apparent every day. Their words condemn them showing how anti neighber anti Christ they really are.
What does “in a fleshly way” mean? Dick head?
“Leatherman” , too good.
Death by oonga boonga.
Think of it this way, Prof. Turley: If you can imagine a gay person having thoughts of killing homophobic bigots, and then, after having such thoughts, realizing that they are morally wrong and repenting of it. That is the same thing this pastor is saying, but from the opposite side of the moral spectrum.
We may be arriving at a point in our society where people no longer believe that they have bad thoughts. Many people today attempt to justify every thought and resulting action that passes through their mind. “Well, he cut me off so I was right to give him the finger.” “He attacked my point of view, so I was right to call him a f***ing As***le.” When they hear about someone who actually admits that they have bad thoughts, they don’t understand it, and actually think that such a person is embracing the very thoughts that they are publicly confessing as sinful.
If you’ll permit an old gay guy from giving his 2 cents worth…for me the real shocker is the voices that are raised against hate mongers like this minister. When I was young almost everybody felt the way these people do today…Nothing LEO’s liked better than beating up homos, and if they died and some did NO ONE CARED! The French cut our heads off and for the most part the rest of the western world like nothing better than throwing us into prison.
Life is better now, not great and idiots like these ministers and the closet cases in the Catholic Church trying desperately to stop the forward march of time, there are days that can really be depressing… All in all with supporters like you guys and so many great people in this country. IT REALLY DOES GET BETTER.
I think Professor Turley and everyone else is missing the point of what this pastor is saying. If you weren’t raised in a fundamentalist Christian church or brought up in a Christian home, then you probably won’t be able to grasp his point.
“The flesh” in the bible, is your “sinful nature”, or your “ego” or the part that wants to exalt oneself or serve the devil. The part that is subject to temptation, drawing one into sin Romans 7:25 says “So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.”
The pastor is actually saying that he, according to the temptation he experiences to be self-righteous, may sometimes have evil thoughts about killing gays. He acknowledges that these thoughts are wrong and repents of them, endeavoring to stop thinking that way. So when he says “kill them all” in a fleshly way, he means in an evil way, and sinful way. He acknowledges that such a thought is wrong.
So he is actually saying something that is good, even to those who are gay.